I was trying to add the "blue ball of energy" body to my Luminous Sphere animation, to settle once and for all how much Man's band angles in the egg. I found these quotes, which do say that "alignment" with the second attention assemblage point is what happens if you reach Silent Knowledge.
And almost all the particulars are there, but it's vague.
It uses the term "stomach". Which one? The actual stomach? What part, the center?
Belly button is nice, and implies we're talking about the actual stomach inside, and not the belly.
But oddly, Juan said 1 foot, Zuleica says 1.5 feet, and I KNOW there's a quote that gives it in inches somewhere.
I can take all of them, and finally pinpoint that place you wiggle your fingers, or rub gently, to make the dent in the blue ball of energy.
Fortunately, I can see both. the spot does in fact clicker a lot when you wiggle your fingers there, and the "blue ball of energy" does in fact become visible in the deep red zone on the J curve.
But it's VERY hard to be that precise when looking at such sights.
"Precise" is a feature of the tonal.
Those sights are in the second attention. Maybe even, only in dreaming awake.
So it's not like you can go to "used energy body junk yard", find one, and measure things.
I'll try to duplicate exactly what I see at the end, so you all know it's worth wiggling those fingers, just as Zuleica said.
But also, so you all know how very difficult it is to pin such things down.
Please notice from the 3 quotes I found in the books, that either Hermalinda had never "seen" it herself, or she was playing dumb for Carlos.
But my guess would be, a "precise" sight like Juan gave, is a male thing.
Afterall, this stuff is kind of a phantom construct of the old seers.
To assume it's just another copy of our standard reality, but "over there" is what beginners do.
And if you took a child the way the old seers did, a "youngling" to teach as an apprentice, you could come up with many other sights to see, that would be your energy body.
Still, I'd like to depict it as close to what's in all places in the books, that it can be.
And then maybe that will motivate people to actually learn to see it themselves?
In some ways, these cartoons are a "trick".
Not in a bad way!
A few of the advanced have figured it out.
If we can just get the inventory experts arguing about details this small, it's a lot better than when they were insisting they're the most impeccable person around.
Anything REAL, is better than the crummy make believe our Castaneda fan community got stuck with for 50 years!
That's the trick. You don't realize, you're now treating it "as real".
Rule #2 of darkroom: If you treat something that can't possibly be there as real, the assemblage point shifts sideways to make it more so.
Of course, you still need to be able to execute rule #1: If you gaze in silence in darkness at anything "that can't possibly be there", the assemblage point moves down along the J curve.
But Rule #2 alone is better than nothing.
Rule #1 is too much work for most people.
*** The quotes I already have ***
Sorcerers consider the assemblage point to be the place where the flow of direct energy is turned
into sensory data and interpreted as the world
of everyday life. Don Juan said that the
assemblage point, aside from doing all this,
also has a most important secondary function:
it is the linking connection between the
physical body and the assemblage point of
the energy body. He described such a
connection as being analogous to two
magnetized circles, each the size of a
tennis ball, coming together, attracted
by forces of intent.
He also said that when the physical body
and the energy body are not joined, the
connection between them is an ethereal
line, which sometimes is so tenuous that
it seems not to exist. Don Juan was certain
that the energy body is pushed farther and
farther away as one grows older, and that
death comes as the result of the severance
of that tenuous connection.
***
Hermelinda had understood that all the
points were in our physical body, but Juan
Tuma explained that since the luminous
body is quite big, some of the points are
as much as three feet away from the physical
body.
In a sense they are outside of us, and yet
they are not. They are on the periphery of
our luminosity and thus still belong to the
total body.
The most important of those points is located
a foot away from the stomach, 40 degrees to
the right of an imaginary line shooting
straight forward.
Juan Tuma told us that point was a center of
assembling for the second attention; and that
it is possible to manipulate it by gently
stroking the air with the palms of the hands.
***
Zuleica must have seen what I was going
through. She suddenly began to explain
that the second attention belongs to the
luminous body, just as the first attention
belongs to the physical body. She said
that the point where the second attention
assembles itself was situated right where
Juan Tuma had described it the first time
we met- approximately one and one-half
feet in front of the midpoint between
the stomach and the belly button and
four inches to the right.
23 Comments
How interesting, I listen to the song (scooter - ramp , the Negr999) and translate and read the text at the same time. It feels very strange and exciting, I am more excited than before...🤸💃🕺
I have to do more " affection for the energy body"!!!!
You're correct that it begins to encourage the energy body to swarm the torso area, and remain there.
VISIBLY!
And it's not "vague" at all.
It ought to be shocking. So that you run for your life shouting, "My stomach is on fire with blue flames!!!"
But you don't, because you're in "Heightened Awareness".
So instead of having the big reward you worked so long to get, you're like,
"Ok. There it is. I guess they didn't make that up at all."
Yawn.
It's almost like, you've been in prison for 20 years, and the first day you get out, you run to See's Candy for a 5 pound box of their finest chocolates.
Only to discover, your taste buds didn't survive that long eating prison food.
[removed]
There's comment that u/Cautious_Recipe3847 submitted 2 days ago, that the mods just can't seem to keep approved. So here's the comment, with the technical article URL modified:
" Hello, Dan! I think this can solve the difficulty of translating cartoons into different languages. I wrote an article with the technical part and there is also a detailed video on how to do it on YouTube, which I translated using the described technology into English. In this video, I left the sound from the original track and applied the neural network translation, but you can completely remove the original sound and leave only the translation. "
technical article: http://archive.today/va32b
detailed video:
The ChatGPT results seem to be nearly flawless
He even figures out what it's about half the time.
Here's a "preliminary investigation" of how accurate I can be.
NOT!!!!
It turns out Juan Tuma's point is not at all where Zuleica's point is.
We'll have to compromise and wiggle in the middle.
After I find more texts that is.
Not to worry!
It REALLY doesn't become both visible, and "As thick as water".
Just remember, Carlos wiggled his fingers for 200-800 hours.
I estimated it from the storyline.
Gratuliere picture
Great
I badly need that quote from don Juan saying that in SK position, he prefers a slight shift left to make it "sublime".
We posted it in here at some point.
You mentioned the shift left in a previous thread here – https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/comments/tfqr7a/holding_the_middle/i0xq7nh/
Well I'm glad I didn't just now imagine it.
But unfortunately, I didn't quote the books back then. Just my Ally.
The Allies of course, don't really know that. They just channel silent knowledge to you.
Your own!
They're "Silent Knowledge Topic Selectors".
For example, the talking lizards were well out of the reach of the Men of Knowledge.
But with a complex ritual (tensegrity is OUR ritual), done sincerely, they could move their assemblage points, with the help of an Ally, to where lizards foresee all.
But actually, as super cool as talking lizards are, it's just Silent Knowledge.
Which hints at why don Juan suggested reading text.
Because the talking lizards, the moth dust that brings mushroom shapes, traveling on water, and every other ritual don Juan taught Carlos, involving power plants, was just a method of selecting a specific "presentation method" for silent knowledge.
Using the Ally to "bridge the gap" for people who can't reach that state.
Or for Men of Knowledge, who even if they learned to do that without the ritual, power plants and Ally, couldn't trade it for goods or services.
They needed something that works on anyone.
Not something as difficult as darkroom is.
You can't charge to torture people.
Thus the power plants and all the rest. So they could sell "Talking Lizard Seances" to the Olmec population.
Darn Cholita... I've told her, she could cash in BIG TIME.
She HAS the talking lizard...
What more could she ask for.
I have no problem with someone cashing in on sorcery, if they really demo actual visible magic for wealthy Hollywood customers.
Maybe Soledad even did that. Like bribery to writers and producers.
Couldn't hurt at all to have a Spielberg see real magic!
I suppose this also hints at why you can shift slightly left when you reach the purple zone, and "taint" it to be more sublime.
Carlos tried to explain that to us in private classes, but by the time his finger got way over there class members were moving their feet around impatiently, and whispering to each other that he didn't actually run his finger on any private parts on the young woman.
Speaking of private classes, I hear Armando or Eddy have been going around trying to create the idea Armando was in private classes. Probably from me featuring him and Eddy as con artists on my facebook page.
But he wasn't in private classes.
I attended nearly all of them. Might only have missed 5 or so, out of 100+.
Jadey was in the ones for women that I never got to see. Maybe in some "night classes" too.
No Armando anywhere as far as we know.
But let's say he was.
How is that "qualification" to steal from us, with his fake books?
I mean, the private classes were 100% bad players.
Just the same as everywhere in our community.
Carlos just picked out the ones he hoped would be serious about it, but none of them were.
I always wondered about the mirror in the river ritual as I live near a lake. I haven’t tried it yet.
It's rather pointless.
In the amount of time it would take to build the mirror from scratch (a mandatory part of that exercise), and the time to travel to the water, you could have done so much darkroom that you got to break the laws of physics by traveling through a portal with an inorganic being.
With the tensegrity, they show up right away!
If you can get silent.
That was just "show biz" to keep Carlos entertained, and would likely not have worked at all if Carlos hadn't already learned to be silent.
No silence, no inorganic being purple blob in the mirror.
Not to mention, Carlos was being taught with the Nagual's blow from the start but didn't remember any of it.
Quotes about the double are wanted, right? As it seems for me the luminous ball is also the energy body ..not sure why, I guess because it is made from energy too :)
Btw from where is the quote on the picture? I cannot remember reading it and just searched in the all in one pdf and it is not there so I guess in some other publication?
It's from the "all in one" made by Techno.
Just the standard books. That one possibly Eagle's Gift?
It's sad how poorly the searches work in various software.
If you're searching an electronic book, often those are optical scanned and so have damage to the words that stops them from being found.
Yes, "double" = energy body for the most part.
It's also = "shapeshifted" in my opinion.
And in our sleeping dreams, it's still the same thing if you ask me.
It's just far away from the "real" copy of reality.
Lost in infinity.
That's what makes women like Cholita valuable, and one or two more from the workshops.
Carlos took the time to let everyone know.
Once in a while you run into a person who's double comes to visit their tonal.
That gives a sorcerer "access" . As Carlos put it.
Theoretically those would be easier to teach.
Carmela was one of those. Maybe that's why it bothered Carlos when she went home with her brothers.
Because her double didn't want to leave.
In this instance, with that file, the slow searching is entirely a result of the PDF format (my file is derived from the 16 books in one .txt file, expanded to 20 publications, that was produced from the UK versions of the books...not many if any artifacts in a .txt file).
Things slow down with files that contain A LOT of pages. Though alternate reader like FoxIt do speed things up even more.
Searching in other formats, like ePub, is MUCH faster.
Adobe...the digital gangsters of the software industry.
I'm afraid that the two publications I just downloaded might have duplicates.
An entire section or two, repeated.
I'll try to pay more attention, but when you see the same text come up in your search, and it's paragraphs of the same, it seems likely that's just different notes, or a reference back to something early in the books.
No there is an amount of duplication in the notes.
Almost intentionally so.
Sometimes several people that attended the same workshop, then took their own version of what was said.l and made it available on the 1990's internet
And there are also, different translations from whatever language the source notes were taken in.
I've worked at reducing that, somewhat, but it's hasn't been a priority to eliminate all of it.
That's for sure.
But we'll be able to train an AI on it.
That'll be a huge help.
It might even be able to write short cartoons and animate them itself!
Of course by then we'll be flooded with copycat but completely wrong, Castaneda cartoons designed to make bad men look good.
if we get out ahead of that, we might succeed.
We still call tissues "Kleenex".
All brands might get called that.
I'm not sure why, but now I feel like having a coke.
We'll have to make a cartoon where Marko, the bad little boy, uses an AI too make his own teaching materials. And opens a school with Shaman Bob, on the bad end of town.
Mostly teaching how great Marko is and how Shaman Bob carries the money bag for him.
Like Judas.
It seems this text is from "Journal of Applied Hermeneutics"; and same text is in this post https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/comments/q6xswn/comment/hgf254b/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3
i found more quotes about the dent (is this always the same dent or are they different?):
- an itching and a felt dent after finger wiggling (after zuleica's instructions)
- about a dent carlos kicked into lydia and rosa (crest of right hipbone)
the right hipbone is used several times:
- carlos was told to smack himself gently between right hipbone and ribcage
- don juan smacked carlos on the crest of right hipbone
- don juan hit carlos between hipbone and ribcage
from all in one pdf, page 855,
eagle's gift, chapter 13, page 129:
".. Zuleica warned me that if I did not move my fingers she was going to bop me on the head. The longer I kept up the wavering motion, the closer I felt the itching. It finally got as near as five or six inches from my body. It was as if something in me had shrunk. I actually thought I could feel a dent. I then had another eerie sensation. I was falling asleep and yet I was conscious. .."
from all in one pdf, page 855,
eagle's gift, chapter 13, page 129:
".. In my next session with Zuleica she told me that I had succeeded in making a dent in my luminosity all by myself, and that making a dent meant bringing a distant point in my luminous shell closer to my physical body, therefore closer to control. She asserted repeatedly that from the moment the body learns to make that dent, it is easier to enter into dreaming. I agreed with her. I had acquired a strange impulse, a sensation that my body had instantly learned to reproduce. It was a mixture of feeling at ease, secure, dormant, suspended without tactile sense and at the same time fully awake, aware of everything.
La Gorda said that the Nagual Juan Matus had struggled for years to create that dent in her, in all three little sisters, and in the Genaros as well, so as to give them the permanent ability to focus their second attention. He had told her that ordinarily the dent is created on the spur of the moment by the dreamer when it is needed, then the luminous shell changes back to its original shape. But in the apprentices' case, because they did not have a Nagual leader, the depression was created from the outside and was a permanent feature of their luminous bodies, a great help but also a hindrance. It made all of them vulnerable and moody.
I remembered then that once I had seen and kicked a depression in the luminous shells of Lydia and Rosa. I thought that the dent was at the height of the upper portion of the outside of their right thigh, or perhaps just at the crest of their hipbone. La Gorda explained that I had kicked them in the dent of their second attention and that I had nearly killed them. .."
from all in one pdf, page 992,
fire from within, chapter 14, p105:
".. He told me then to relax my muscles, shut off my internal dialogue, and let my assemblage point drift away under the spell of inner silence. He urged me to smack myself gently but firmly on my right side, between my hipbone and my ribcage.
I did that three times and I was sound asleep. It was a most peculiar state of sleep. My body was dormant, but I was perfectly aware of everything that was taking place. I could hear don Juan talking to me and I could follow every one of his statements as if I were awake, yet I could not move my body at all. .."
from all in one pdf, page 1005,
fire from within, chapter 15 , page 118:
".. "But do you honestly believe that those Toltec seers are still alive?" I asked.
He laughed and shook his head in disbelief.
"It's time for you to shift that assemblage point of yours just a bit," he said. "I can't talk to you when you are in your idiot's stage."
He smacked me with the palm of his hand on three spots: right on the crest of my right hipbone, on the center of my back below my shoulder blades, and on the upper part of my right pectoral muscle.
My ears immediately began to buzz. A trickle of blood ran out of my right nostril, and something inside me became unplugged. It was as if some flow of energy had been blocked and suddenly began to move again. .."
from all in one pdf, page 1013,
fire from within, chapter 16, p126:
".. he had me change into yet a deeper state of heightened awareness. He hit me on my right side, between my hipbone and my rib cage. That blow sent me soaring into a radiant light, into a diaphanous source of the most peaceful and exquisite beatitude. .."
The itching and kick were the same position and dent we try to make.
I think the hipbone to rib is to "undo" a Nagual's blow dent?
>It finally got as near as five or six inches from my body.
It IS dentable.
However, expect it to take HUNDREDS of hours.
Look at the timeline and comments in that book and you'll come to 200-800 hours, based on all night long and how many days.
But, the good news is that wiggling the fingers is very entertaining once you can see and feel that point.
And, it comes with a "secret" I won't reveal.
Which doesn't require you to wiggle the fingers for all that long.
Except it's hit or miss if you get that "bonus".
A single deliberate visit by Cholita in my vicinity is worth 10 of that bonus.
>from the moment the body learns to make that dent, it is easier to enter into dreaming.
I believer, our situation is slightly different.
Carlos got the Nagual's blow before visiting with Zuleica.
Good thing, because he'd have gotten super bored otherwise. Wiggling his fingers all night, or sitting back to back with La Gorda, just listening all night.
In our case, we're following the Tensegrity path into the second attention.
Carlos even called it that somewhere that I ran across recently.
The difference is, we get to bring out our double and then find "the abstract".
Carlos even told us that would happen!
And the abstract is also a way to go into dreaming directly from awake.
There's an argument to be made that "womb dreaming" utilizes the abstract!
Hinted at when don Juan turned Taisha down on power plants, saying she "was already there".
And elsewhere, that women start out in the abstract already.
>But in the apprentices' case, because they did not have a Nagual leader, the depression was created from the outside and was a permanent feature of their luminous bodies, a great help but also a hindrance. It made all of them vulnerable and moody.
So the second attention dent is something kind of new?
I sure wish we could blame the moodiness of new people in here, on that dent.
Then we could kick it as needed, instead of exploding their heads.
>I thought that the dent was at the height of the upper portion of the outside of their right thigh, or perhaps just at the crest of their hipbone.
I should probably show this in that video also, but it comes out to the same height within 2 inches.
So everyone just feel your hip bone top, and look at that new video where Juan and Zuleica's height are shown.
They agree closely enough!
Especially since that assemblage point is the size of a tennis ball. Meaning, if you miss wiggling on the perfect spot by 2 inches, you'll still be hitting that point!
Sorcery is amazingly consistent. I remember when bad people were criticizing the new books starting after "Tales of Power", saying Carlos just added a bunch of new stuff.
NOTHING COULD BE FURTHER FROM THE TRUTH!
He just explained more aspects of it, but nothing at all changed.
And that he was "stealing" from idiotic sources like Dzogchen???
Come on... That's so horribly delusional.
Even the "Four Noble Truths" of Buddhism are seriously bad advice.
You believe those, and it's all over for you as far as learning real magic goes.
>He urged me to smack myself gently but firmly on my right side, between my hipbone and my ribcage.
I suppose it's worth a try, but keep in mind Carlos had been dented over and over again. There's no telling if that helped this move work.
I'll let Juann smack himself and try it out.
Unless I can get Cholita to smack me there.
>He smacked me with the palm of his hand on three spots: right on the crest of my right hipbone,
Carlos clued us in on that one, however I got into "big trouble" with him by bringing a lifesized medical skeleton up the stairs of dance Home, so that when he arrived for that class, he saw a halloween prank.
I just wanted to make sure where he was telling us to push!
But now I kind of understand the disturbance to intent that caused.
Forget the rest of the smacks for now. We don't know if a non-Nagual can make that work.
>he had me change into yet a deeper state of heightened awareness. He hit me on my right side, between my hipbone and my rib cage. That blow sent me soaring into a radiant light, into a diaphanous source of the most peaceful and exquisite beatitude. .."
See Juann! It pays off if you can make it work.
I'll still hold out for Cholita to smack me.