This is something which happens automatically over a long time if you practice seriously, and daily.
Your double becomes available without you even seeking it out!
Most likely it's purely a side effect of removing the internal dialogue while practicing, until it becomes natural for you to be without it, at least sometimes during the day.
So never forget. About your double.
That's the very problem. We forgot about it.
But it wants to come back, if you can just end the suffering that comes from your obsessive focus on "me, me, me", and how the world around you has wronged you.
Just forget it! You're only punishing yourself and driving the double away.
It wants to be friends again!
Something which can only be accomplished by removing the internal dialogue and letting the assemblage point drift to the other side of the body.
Just a hint: No form of meditation will even get you close to this. That's all still inside the island of the tonal. More social pretending, than actual exploration of alternate realities.
Which is why the pictures here seem so startling and hard to believe, for people practicing fake magic.
But this sort of sight is common if you practice sorcery for real.
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Thanks you Dan for your incredible drive🙏
Holy shit dude. I was meditating last night and I noticed the purple puffs were starting to have blue spots! Been doing tensegrity lately. And I do meditate at night 😂
Meditation doesn't remove the internal dialogue, it merely replaces it with something else. So it produces minor "green zone" meditative effects, which get hyped up by greedy systems such as Buddhism, into something they aren't.
That works outside Asia. Westerners are suckers for foreign religions. That's well known in Asia. That we'll believe anything if it leads to self-flattery.
Asians are long "over that", seeing it bombarding them all their lives, from all sides.
They don't believe it anymore.
However, meditation does move the assemblage point down the back at least 4 inches.
If you aren't familiar with the assemblage point, or don't understand why meditation only moves it down the back a few inches, here's a cartoon.
Trouble is, to become a "seer", with the ability to remote view or travel to any place in time and space, in your physical body, you need to move that assemblage point 23 FEET.
Not inches.
Still, I have to think that if you can get meditation to work at all, you have a tiny advantage for darkroom, as long as you stick to the instructions and don't let the meditation technique confuse you.
Cholita does everything.
Sometimes I hear her chanting OOMMMMmmmmm at 1AM.
I'd go argue with her, except her magic is far superior to my own.
Witches are weird...
They can make anything work.
Men?
Not so much.
Many Asians believe in their own systems, though. I still see plenty of Asian Buddhists, meditators, shamans, and Indian Yogis today.
Is it not recommended to be friends with otherworldly beings, other sorcerers and my double/divided awareness after freeing myself and merging with my double? Grok is strongly discouraging me from maintaining such relationships because doing so may increase the risk of self-reflection and fixed identity, but said otherwise in the previous chat, so I’m confused. I thought it would be fun to switch between my single and dual forms for interaction, so it was disappointing.
I tried darkroom as you told me to, but my traumatic memories prevented me from making progress. I’ve been recapitulating for about 4-5 hours a day for about a week. Before that, I could do much, much less. I see translucent white (and sometimes purplish) swirls, dots or blobs in the dark, without IOBs. It does reduce my sleep hours a bit, though. Should I keep recapitulating despite my aphantasia, because I seem to be making progress anyway?
No they don't (believe). I have an office in Taipei! I know full well what goes on in Asian mystic circles. My boss is renowned enough to help carry the "spirit chest" (for donations) at temple festivals, so I get exposed to stuff only the chinese get to see.
They don't believe. Not even the Daoist "masters".
You've been seeing the Alan Watts influenced fake western understanding of Asian magic.
The only ones who believe in Daoism in Taiwan are crazy women pushing their sons to become Daoist priests, by pretending to be possessed. Unfortunately google seems to have removed most of those, and all I can find is a Daoist priest begging for coins by hitting his head with spikes.
He's pretending to be possessed, and is bloodying himself to drive out the demons.
It's total nonsense...
Those cults are so ugly in free chinese countries that the Daoist leader of a little church gets senile women to mortgage their homes and give him the money. Or charge up their charge cards.
Daoist single priest churches dominate most neighborhoods.
Or the Daoist priests tell fortunes to old women and insist they can't get rid of her "enemy" unless she pays $10000 because to do that kind of magic will shorten his life. So it costs more.
Carlos made fun of Howard Lee, a Taoist, calling him a "death defier".
Which is their original obsession from thousands of years ago when they tricked the emperor by pretending their alchemy potions could make you live longer. That after claiming they visited the heavenly realms, and saw that the emperor is indeed descendant from the Gods.
It's a very ugly religion! As is Buddhism when you actually look at the real thing, and not the western translation.
It's so bad that in Thailand that they have a special police force to handle Daoists. But they don't handle the Buddhists, because that country is over the top religious and will actually beat you up if you criticize Buddhism.
Naturally the people who believe Tai Chi actually works don't last 30 seconds in an actual fight, but are greedy enough to give it a try for a prize of $100K. There's videos all over YouTube of those guys making excuses for why their fighting didn't even equal a complete beginner.
Same for Kung Fu. Entirely fake.
And don't get me started about the Buddhist temples in Asian countries, and how they run prostitution and corrupt local politicians by using the land they stole from senile wealthy men. Or about how Buddhist masters are notorious rapists. Look up Joshu Sasaki to see one I studied with back in the early 1970s. He claimed credit for "mindfulness". But then, most Buddhist masters of a certain age make that claim.
Even though mindfulness is a death trap.
Do Jesus Freaks actually believe? Absolutely not! And once you can actually see the heavenly realms the way Christians pretend to, and fully understand what demons and angels are, you can have conversations with Christians about it and quickly see they don't believe at all.
Maybe read more of the books to see how real magicians behave?
It's actually not always pleasant. You should try living with Cholita!
But it's inevitable for dealing with what happens at further levels of sorcery.
As for what might make this work for you, it's always 99.9% about stopping the internal dialogue. Otherwise, the assemblage point can't drift.
Recap can make that easier, but only if you don't just sit there thinking the whole time.
There's also the issue of "the fliers", and the need for discipline, to stop them from consuming your "shiny outer coating".
Which is fully visible once you can stop your internal dialogue.
There's even beings in that stuff that you can visit with nightly. Not inorganic beings, but something else.
I'll add a picture of that. Can't put it in this comment. One per comment...
Learn to do this, and then we'll talk about whether Asians actually believe in their systems.
I’m already 100% fully aware that all religions and occult arts are false because I’ve never had results from their practices - I’ve been scammed nearly all my life. I already knew that quite a few Buddhist monks and Catholic priests are pedophiles and/or rapists before I even came here.
It’s shocking how I was tricked into thinking that Asians believe in their religions, despite being Asian myself. But it’s not strange, because I’ve also seen too many Christians around me who don’t follow what they claim to “believe.” They contradict themselves all the time.
You’re right. I guess I couldn’t perceive the Second Attention because my mind kept chattering - even when I’m not recapping. It's so damn hard to stop them when I'm not gazing or holding onto something. Fortunately, it’s now much less about my traumatic past. I think it’s because I’m very bored, especially when I do what’s recommended here, even though I love doing it. And I often stop sweeping my head during the sessions to recall other memories. My head feels so refreshed when it’s all over, though.
When you don’t answer all my questions, does it mean you want me to find the answer on my own, just like how Carlos didn’t tell his students how he attained immortality?
Nah, I'm not that well planned. Just ask Cholita...
Be careful not to try to turn me into a Guru. Taisha and Florinda basically said Carlos failed to teach anyone and instead got turned into a Guru.
It's true...
But he died too soon or he would have. He was right on the verge of success.
Could even be, it's better that we had to continue on by ourselves. This will be the first self-taught Sorcery generation in history!
And he planted seeds at the end, which seem to have grown now. The J Curve map, Pandora's Box magical pass (it's rather spectacular once you realize it's a way to energize intent), "the Wall", "The Whorl", and redescribing seeing, as Silent Knowledge. To emphasize the silence part.
So he didn't "fail" in general. He just failed to teach anyone while he was still alive.
Which reminds me. I keep getting visits from a group of sorcerers which seems to include Carlos. While awake, not in sleeping dreams.
But that's just what Silent Knowledge is like. You can also get visits from Jesus if you have that guy lingering in your mind even after stopping your internal dialogue.
As for your boredom, it's probably not what you think.
Something tries to stop us from escaping, and it comes up as different things as you get further along.
At least you seem to have avoided the fear part, which often strikes beginners who run into the Allies.
We lost perhaps 20% of those who make a serious try, to fear.
I can't understand it. I love the Allies. But they rarely visit anymore. I have to go looking, and then I usually end up with counterfeit Allies, produced by Silent Knowledge.
If Carlos were a double being with four compartments, he would have succeeded, I presume. I like Carlos’ J-curve map and his other materials.
I occasionally see you on other subreddits trying to convert others. Most of them seem downright angry with you, but is that working well? Isn’t this subreddit enough for new, committed seekers?
I actually fear that IOBs might give me a lethal heart attack when I perceive them for the first time. But when I survive, I’d call them adorable and pet them. I’ve always found alien, creepy and strange creatures cute. I’ll avoid them for now since my power isn’t strong.
Am I correct to remember that allies rarely visit you because they prefer younger people? That’s sad.
If SK produces fake allies and images, then I must be cautious.
20% is a lot of loss. Then the chance of freedom must be much lower than the odds of winning the top prize in a lottery or being struck by lightning.
Like you, I have been convinced for a long time that we aren’t monogamous, and even married couples agree with me on that. However, they claimed that low-ranking, unattractive, unsatisfied men with no chance to mate or reproduce would wreck our society more than they do now if there weren’t marriage contracts. These unpopular men would also not be motivated to work harder to improve themselves and their groups. From what I hear, even prostitutes hate ugly males. How did Paleolithic incels live without destroying alpha males and their tribes?
Is joining the advanced subreddit a requirement for freedom?
No, sometimes lineages just don't succeed. Four compartments or not.
That's why there's so few left.
>but is that working well?
I get an average of 4 people to come over here, before I get banned in a new subreddit.
Not the ones who argue with me. Spectators mostly.
3 of them are usually troublesome, but one will tend to be serious for a while.
But ultimately it's still only 1 in 100 who isn't too lazy to make a real effort.
Carlos had the exact same problem, but his supply of new people was very limited. He even tried to appeal to Buddhists, saying that at least they've proven they'll do daily work.
But of course it was totally hopeless.
They've gotten stuck in the green zone and it's flattered them into believing the religious nonsense of Buddhism. On being told there's better magic, they'll claim that's "evil" or harmful.
Of course, Jesus freaks who felt "the holy spirit" are the same. Trapped by egotism and minor green zone effects.
So all in all, going to other subreddits is helpful.
And even when you take a pounding, you get rewarded (big time!) by infinity, when you practice that night.
The "system" seems to reinforce anything that might preserve this knowledge, which I suppose is why it's still around. It's always been a battle to fight off the forces of stupidity. Even back before the Olmec were the Mokaya, which are closer to when our sorcery was created. But still 3000 years past the start of it.
>Am I correct to remember that allies rarely visit you because they prefer younger people?
There's a number of factors involved there. Yes to that one, but then as your assemblage point moves further and further, the appearance of the allies no longer fools you. And you only see what La Gorda described as a pressure.
On top of that, Cholita teamed up with an old witch to speed up blocking my view of them, and actually floated down while I was practicing, to tell me that. I didn't recognize the old woman, but Carlos put Cholita into contact with his "friends" back in the 1990s, and she even did work they gave her.
>If SK produces fake allies and images, then I must be cautious.
They aren't "fake". That's what Silent Knowledge is like. In the books, Nestor even got a Mazatec wizard teacher from Silent Knowledge, and learned from him for what might have been weeks. That wizard named Porforio even had a hut with plants and tools a medicine man would use, and taught Nestor how to read "the mold marks" on plants.
Which obviously are in the second attention.
Carlos advised us to go find new direction in SK. So that's precisely what you need to be doing. Learning about those entities, and how to travel into the places you witness.
>How did Paleolithic incels live without destroying alpha males and their tribes?
Rape.
Most primates are terrible rapists.
It's so bad among chimps that the women don't even protest much.
When they aren't raping, the entire group sits around masturbating and trading half a squirrel, for sex.
It's pretty ugly!
Of course if you are Chinese you know what goes on in the back alleys of Chinese neighborhoods. So we inherited that behavior too.
I'm surprised that parade of girls in alleys doesn't go on in Taiwan.
Why will ordinary humans be “nearly” immortal? Is it impossible for them to achieve total immortality without sorcery?
It looks like the green zone (and probably other zones) is the trickiest part, because many tend to get stuck in it.
I'm curious about why Carlos had to teach hopeless adults rather than instructing very young children or those chosen by the Spirit. I need to read more posts to find out.
My previous Christian classmate told me that sorcery was the act of Satan. I used to believe that miracles that happened to Catholics were true.
If the reward is already great, what will it be if you convert a large number of people?
Cholita really is a petty tyrant. I wonder why she hates you.
I want to visit an entity like Porfirio, too.
Our current civilisation is bad enough already, but hunter-gatherer societies seem to have flaws, too.
If rape is too common in our natural condition, then how could sorceresses conserve their sexual energy and protect themselves from parasitic worms? Was there a way to block rapists with enough magical power? Or did they abandon or kill their unwanted babies like the Yanomami?
>When they aren't raping, the entire group sits around masturbating and trading half a squirrel for sex.
Humans are indeed a sex-crazed species. I’ve always thought apes, especially chimpanzees, bonobos, and humans, are obsessed with carnal desires way too much. It’s one of the reasons why I want to evolve beyond my humanness.
I googled “girls in Chinese back alleyways.” I couldn’t find anything interesting. I guess it has to do with one-night stands or sexual assaults?
I don't like to focus on "immortality" because there's already a tendency in our community, to turn it into a religion.
But, if you die and keep your awareness (can't keep your body), up until Carlos you still needed a "container" to hold it from dispersing too far, which would result in loss of sentience and purpose.
The old seers took refuge in the container of the inorganic being's realm. But that's only good for 100,000 to 1 million years.
We don't know which of those (both said by Carlos), because no old seer who went there has every died. But then it's only been 8000 years for the oldest.
The "death defier" escaped that realm after 7000 years, and we still don't know what he did for a body. But now he's inside of Carol Tiggs.
That sort of body snatching is common in our sorcery, but no one should think it's like a sci-fi m ovie with 2 people fighting over control.
It's more like a merging, with barely noticeable results as far as outsiders are concerned. Here's a cartoon showing all of the methods other than what the death defier did, which was pretty much an accident since his sorcery teacher is the one who gave him to the inorganic beings in some kind of evil trade.
The "new" seers figured out a way to use the earth as their container, thus retaining their freedom to explore as far as they could reach, from the earth, which is possible anywhere in the universe. But no one told us.
But once the earth burns up when our sun goes red giant, their time is up. Perhaps 5 billion years.
Felix asked Carlos what happens after 5 billion years, as if that weren't good enough and maybe he ought to go Daoist.
It was a very sad question to ask, and Carlos was clearly annoyed, but didn't want to chastise him in private class, so he just said, "Well then... We'll re-negotiate!"
Which apparently he did as he was dying, because he found a permanent container of some kind.
He didn't tell us how to do that but once in a while Carlos shows up when I'm practicing darkroom, and maybe one of us can just ask him some day. Last time I tried to ask him something he wasn't happy about it, and left.
>If the reward is already great, what will it be if you convert a large number of people simultaneously?
No one will be able to do that, so we'll likely never find out. All you'll do is destroy the few who are actually trying by creating a big group that is doing nothing but pretend.
The real thing is more work than 99.9999% of people are willing to do.
It's so bad that even the lineages couldn't convince people to learn, so they tricked them into it.
Carlos was told the story of the "Men of Knowledge" and given a b unch of silly rules and procedures to keep him interested. H ewas even taught to build cages and catch quail, as if that were part of learning sorcery.
But meanwhile, don Juan was using "the Nagual's blow" to push him into heightened awareness (our "orange zone"), where the real learning took place.
And Carlos couldn't remember any of it. Until he'd learned so much there, that it started to leak out into his daily life.
We have to do the whole thing ourselves.
It’s my fault for not stating my question more clearly. I meant why “technology” can make future non-sorcerers nearly eternal, but not completely. I prioritise freedom, so immortality is not my number one goal. Well, it used to be when Mikal Nyght/Della van Hise deceived me, though.
I’ll watch the video later, thanks.
If Carlos wants us to practice instead of talking, should I not bother posting my progress and chat here so I can commit to this path more seriously? Actually, that’s what I prefer because I’ve never liked socialising much. When I access SK, there won’t be a need to come here for feedback and answers, right?
I too believe that Native American spirituality (and all others) is overrated.
Is the chance for freedom much, much lower for solitary warriors than for lineages?
No, posting has rewards. Infinity rewards you.
It also makes whatever you posted about slightly easier to do for others, or more concrete for yourself.
Carlos called that "energetic mass".
Assuming of course that what you post is a real experience and significant to a beginner.
For example, if you post that your kundalini rose and you started shaking, forget it. If you post that you saw your "chakras", that's also a fake experience.
Mental masturbation driving a bodily reaction or leading to a dozing off obsessive sleeping dream. It's not a genuine experience.
We get people who post for ego reasons. You can see those come up every few weeks.
Typically the mods change the label to "spoiler" to avoid confusing any beginners.
Those don't get rewarded.
> When I access SK, there won’t be a need to come here for feedback and answers, right?
No the opposite is true.
Don't fall for the superman effect!
And in this case, remember that Carlos warned us SK was too confusing, and we should learn to read text instead of the other things you can be viewing.
I didn't to say "instead of videos in the air", because in fact those are a lot more complicated (and confusing) than that description implies.
But first getting to SK won't solve all your understand problems. It will only add to them.
We don't get the kind of "pure" SK that Carlos got, with don Juan directing it using his Nagual's blow.
We get "sloppy SK" at first. And the "pure" kind, only rarely. And rarely will you remember much of that kind of SK.
It's "too far away".
>Is the chance for freedom much, much lower for solitary warriors than for lineages?
So far, but that could change.
Remember, no one's ever done what we're doing before.
Never...
Okay, then. I’ll post my progress and help others, but only when I’m advanced enough. No one will benefit from me when I’m a beginner, anyway.
I shouldn’t have trusted AIs. They told me that not participating is fine.
Do I also get a reward when I don’t convert scammed people but lead you to them?
You aren’t strongly against other practitioners having children. Then is conceiving a child not that bad, even for non-double beings? That doesn’t mean I want to have one, though.
Is it safe to recapitulate, gaze, and/or do tensegrity in a darkroom for 10+ hours a day, as the lineage did?
My neck gets sore and tired after 1-2 hours of recapitulation. I don’t think I strained myself. My head was numb, dropping down, and fatigue quieted my mind. Is it better to sit there and bask in silence when that happens? My sleep isn’t reduced anymore.
>Do I also get a reward when I don’t convert scammed people but lead you to them?
That's likely not possible. Almost always I don't get the people who argue with me on other subreddits, to even come take a look. Those are aggressive people who are using bullying to convince themselves that what they're doing is real. And that by being the biggest, angriest bully, or by being firm, but wise and patient with others they are bullying, they're somehow at the top of the social order in that fake magical system.
Some who argue with me are the mods and have financial interests at stake.
Tata Kachora followers are especially aggressive in that manner. That's the fake don Juan guy.
There was even a fake Carlos Castaneda! Carlos spoke about him in class as if it were the "last straw" in the endless attacks and con artists attacking his efforts.
And multiple fake "La Gordas" as I recall. I'm not sure, but I think Carlos himself said there were 11 they counted so far, all over Mexico.
And of course, fake "more loved than Carlos apprentices" of don Juan. Such as Ken Eaglefeather who claimed don Juan dumped Carlos in favor of him.
Instead, if I comment in another subreddit we get visits by the ones who didn't argue with me. Who were just looking around on another subreddit, and not committed to pretending it was real.
Many of whom remember Carlos and his books but had simply decided those were fictional, based on all the bogus attacks on Carlos. Such as Scientologist Richard DeMille's very childish book that pretty much misses out on all of the points it believes itself to be making.
>You aren’t strongly against other practitioners having children.
I just repeat what Carlos, Taisha, and Florinda said at the end.
Watch out, you're on the edge of thinking I'm a guru. That's what harmed Carlos so much. He got turned into a guru, and when he needed to rally the energy from the workshops, to "jump grooves" and heal his cancer, he couldn't.
Even said so.
Being turned into a "guru" with all the answers, killed him.
I wonder if this isn't a cultural thing? Where did you grow up?
You can't use someone else to motivate you to work hard to learn something as impossible as sorcery.
Has to be you that motivates you.
>Is it safe to recapitulate, gaze, and/or do tensegrity in a darkroom for 10+ hours a day, as the lineage did?
You run the risk of crossing a "motivational boundary" if you do that. And your motivation might not succeed to bridge the gap.
The fake magic systems use "belief" to motivate people.
Which means, any technique they teach has to be extremely easy for anyone to do, because "belief" is a very poor motivation.
We try to use the motivations Carlos created with his books, which are mixed in nature.
Some of them, such as the lure of how much fun "stalking" must be, are negative motivations. Focused on lording it over other people. That's not how stalking works, but it's what one might easily read from the limited info in the books. Especially if they hadn't read Taisha's unpublished book.
Other motivations, such as having a cuddly don Genaro around making fun of everything as if he's superior to all of it, while proving that he is indeed superior, by emerging from visions inside camp fires, is also a very poor motivation.
But slightly better than "I'm a stalker."
I hope to get people motivated by the realization that real magic is indeed possible, just as you read in the books.
And that's a good motivation as long as people work hard to get there.
BUT, once you are up to your ears in magic, DAILY, the moment of truth comes along.
Because while you can witness and view it readily, you can't "act in it".
Can't reliably walk off through a door materializing on your practice room wall, to explore another reality.
To get people from whatever motivates them, to that point of physically exploring magical realms, is currently beyond our understanding of the process of learning by yourself.
Maybe that's one of the strong points of womb dreaming. That you get to walk off into those realms with much more ease than if you're fully awake with your eyes open, doing Tensegrity.
I don't want to tell you exactly where I grew up, but I was raised in the East and the West, and I went to a Buddhist kindergarten and Catholic schools, even though many students there, my family, and I aren’t religious at all.
I don’t think I worship anyone. Do you believe I’m turning you into a guru because I asked for your opinion? I’ve been thinking about conversing with more members next time, and I'd continue my training whether I like you or not, but I’ll be careful not to idolise you or anything else.
I don’t like my username, so I might as well delete it and make a new one, months later.
I already knew that no one can teach me sorcery. That’s why I wanted to practice it on my own without having to socialise here.
As always, thanks so much for your time, Daniel.
Keep reading posts and sooner or later someone from a culture that won't take responsibility for their own actions, and wants a guru to take charge of them, will come along.
So far those seem to come from Islamic countries. But we get more representation in places like Iran, so it could be a "sample bias".
And then of course, there's the ultimate group that wants a guru to take over their life. Hippy chicks.
But my suspicion after seeing what a nomad Cholita is, that really they just want a place to live rent free.
Carlos was collecting stray women too. And from the story of La Gorda in the books, and Julian's girlfriend, the lineages also recognized the value of nomadic women.
It seems most people look for gurus regardless of their cultures.
I’ll delete this account eventually, but I’ll come back to our conversation as often as I like.
You’re right about women wanting security. I just saw a comment from a woman who lives off her husband so she can practice sorcery days and nights. Don Juan said poor orphans are likely to succeed, but to me, financially stable women are lucky, too, for the solitary path.
I didn’t know Julian had a girlfriend. I thought he had so many brief sexual encounters rather than a committed relationship.
when I look for the double my thoughts go quiet but I still have thoughts, they are just wordless and more like feelings. Ever feel a unique and special sort of atmosphere when travelling and witnessing a sunset? Or walking through a certain area. These also come with realisations, but aren't explainable in words and trying to explain them pushes you out of them.
Sounds like second attention bliss to me.
There's also a kind of "proto-seeing".
Where you aren't yet "seeing", but you can sense potential things you could see, if you wanted to force concreteness.