why does everyone on this forum seem to look down on the use of power plants, when i feel like in this time in history more than ever people are stuck in rigid ways of thinking, an surely certain types of people wouldnt be able to progress without them so why are they never recomended on here an why do people take issue with it
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Post restored, because it is a valid point and something that could stand to be debated.
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The way I heard it is that power plants have the potential to misshape your luminous cocoon. Which, even if that’s true, I’m not advanced enough in this practice to know what impacts that might cause.
Carlos obviously used power plants frequently during the early days of his apprenticeship with don Juan. Power plants will make your assemblage point (AP) move, which can be useful if your AP is rigid. I think don Juan wanted Carlos to have firsthand experience of the second attention.
Someone like u/danl999 might argue that you shouldn’t need power plants to progress and that all you need is to silence your inner dialogue.
But don't forget that Carlos specifically asked don Juan, when they first met, to teach him about power plants.
He needed it for his early 1960s PhD thesis. It was all the rage back then, and Carlos was likely jealous of the anthropologists from UC Riverside, who were closer to the native American reservations and had been studying power plant ceremonies for years.
Whether Carlos needed power plants or not we'll never really know.
They might even have triggered his cancer.
Certainly we do know, don Juan refused to let Taisha and Florinda have any, and La Gorda couldn't have had many because she was still very confused about what power plants do, thinking they'd give them an "unimaginable boost".
When in fact, they pull you back to beginner's levels.
Don Juan couldn't let Carlos get away. The lineage needed Carlos if it wanted to survive. So he gave him what he asked for on their first meeting.
And then exploited his book to try to change "the modality of our times".
Thus no one knows why don Juan really did that. Nor why don Juan told him later that he really needed it because he was a special case.
That's only true "from a certain point of view" as Obi Wan would say.
And as I've witnessed with Carlos, sorcerers don't leave burdens on people. And are very willing to redescribe a bad situation, so as to avoid leaving a lasting "energetically stuck spot" in the awareness of their students.
Such as the thought that all those power plants were more harmful than helpful.
And that whole time in the early books when he was learning about power plants, he was actually being taught using the Nagual's blow.
The power plants were actually unnecessary.
He was off in the orange zone, the first day.
If I had to guess, I'd say it's almost mandatory that a Nagual push an apprentice there, and ask his permission to do that in the future.
Of course, that's a little like this:
I’ll throw in my 2 cents….
The microdosing of psilocybin could be helpful, maybe beneficial for some. Lots of research material out there. I’m willing to bet dollars to donuts this forum gets blown to hell with stoned apes if heroic dosing becomes part of the practice. If it was helpful with consistently shutting off the internal dialogue, CC and the witches wouldve said as much, but AFAIK they said it changes the shape of your luminous sphere.
On a side note. In the first 3-4 books, CC takes the power plants under DJM direction, the Nagual moving the protégés assemblage point and shaking up CC’s rigid socialized view of the world; is how I’ve come to understand it. I think, I’ve read that other apprentices didn’t need the power plants. In this sub, there’s a proven process for moving one’s AP without the shrooms. It’s just a matter of determination.
I think it's a good doorway into expanding consciousness and realizing how crucial perception is. It's important not to get stuck on psychedelics or other substances because we need to learn how to move our assemblage points independently with sheer will.
Are you referring to unlimited, continuous use of power plants, as opposed to a limited number that would be enough to make the AP dislodge, and create that pre-disposition in an individual to move their AP mire easily afterwards?
Just my opinion, but since we don't have guides who know better than us to help us interpret our experiences and tell us what's important and what isn't, the use of power plants by oneself is risky.
The risks are, obsession, digression, regression, insanity of course, death depending on which ones you experiment with, and most mildly, confusion.
It's my understanding that a physical manifestation of certain allies is a molecule found in each of their corresponding power plants. That molecule going into our brains is how they interact with us physically.
During these sorts of unmonitored interactions and AP shifts it's easy to lose sobriety, or discipline, or control, and end up obsessed and confused. Both of which are bad for your progress in sorcery. You either need a real guide or you need to be truly impeccable yourself to make proper use of these experiences.
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Because if you use those you can get yourself hopelessly stuck with your assemblage point shifted to the bottom of your back, and off to the side. And never progress past that position.
It needs to move a total of 23 feet to reach "seeing". Power plants only move it around 6 feet.
And you can get far higher than that by moving your assemblage point, including all the "hallucinations" you can handle. Except fully awake and sober.
Did you look at the map Carlos gave us? What you're talking about is barely interesting at all, once you see what's beyond where power plants move your assemblage point.
Your question is like asking skilled dirt bike rider what's wrong with tricycles?
"Why does everyone here look down on using steroids? Surely in this age of weakness there are more people than ever who are stuck in sedentary lifestyles, they wouldn't be able to be strong without them."
Meanwhile people practicing sorcery are hitting the gym daily.
Maybe it's like that?
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In my opinion, there are positives as well as negatives. It is helpful for those who deny other realities. For me it served once to stop the internal dialogue.