I've been trying to figure out what blocks Silent Knowledge from streaming freely.
It can take me 3 hours just to get any at all to flow, with Cholita having run away to Mexico.
But I've been narrowing the problem down, and can say something generally true about this.
You don't just need to stop your internal dialogue. That allows your assemblage point to move, so it produces magic.
But to make silent knowledge flow, you have to move your assemblage point all the way to the other side of your body. And into alignment with that of your double.
To do that, you have to stop focusing your awareness along the way. That's like tossing an anchor into the ocean. Your ship isn't going anywhere once you do that.
But even with those two correct, and with your assemblage point in alignment with that of your energy body, you still have the problem of how long you can get silent knowledge to stream.
It's not that useful if it only flows one of those "videos in the air" for 1/2 second.
So the third obstacle is expecting rewards.
But it's very hard to explain all the ways that happens.
You'll just "know it" at the time I suppose.
Do that, and you can make individual silent knowledge streams flow for 30 seconds or more.
Just look for the golden sparkles to locate new ones.
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I’m mostly commenting to say I really dig this graphic. Nice reference to the three wise monkeys.
How does dark energy enter this equation? Is it needed to make the assemblage point move in the first place?
Good question!
I'll try to take a look tonight.
With Cholita gone, dark energy is in very short supply.
But one possible clue here is that someone posted a quote from Carlos saying that inorganic beings can be cyclic to us.
From The Art of Dreaming-
“
"The energy necessary to move the assemblage points of sorcerers comes from the realm of inorganic beings," he said, as if he were hurrying to get it over with.
…
I understood don Juan better than I could have thought. Journeying to that world had always meant to me, at an energetic level, a boost of dark energy. I had even thought of it in those terms, long before don Juan voiced his statement.
“
That’s what I was recalling. Thanks for confirming. It’s more reason for me to shore up my recapitulation practice.
Do focusing and expecting rewards effect the movement of the assemblage point too? Can we move the assemblage point with a shorter silence when we stop focusing and stop expecting rewards in addition to silencing the internal dialogue?
No one knows the answer to that!
It's never been done before. Even the lineages didn't do what we're doing.
But you can't "focus on not focusing", so it's likely useless unless you are presented with that situation, while gazing at darkness.
I would suggest that surely there's a vast improvement to "darkroom" which might involve deliberate focusing of your attention, rather than just impassively looking for puffs.
My ally Fancy taught me to rub puffs on my arms until they caught on fire with purple flames.
Definitely different from standard darkroom.
But if you can't visually see that, it's useless.
It's kind of like blowing on a spark to make it turn into a flame.
You have to see the spark or it's not going to work.
That is a fire illustration. Gets the point across succinctly
Here's an AI history of those monkeys.
Reading that, it should become obvious why Eastern philosophy is a total dead end if you actually want to learn sorcery. In fact, it's harmful to your practice if you really fall for it.
But those 3 monkeys are also a symbol to businessmen who have to deal with the Chinese, of how difficult they can be to work with. They never seem to directly face what's really going on, because they have so many rules to prevent it.
I'd quote Carlos on this topic, but the last time I did it was removed by reddit's AI, claiming it was "hate speech".
***
The “see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil” monkeys are Japanese, not Chinese in origin.
The classic image is the Three Wise Monkeys at Tōshō-gū Shrine in Nikkō, Japan, a 17th-century carving. Their Japanese names are usually given as Mizaru covering his eyes, Kikazaru covering his ears, and Iwazaru covering his mouth. The wordplay matters: in Japanese, -zaru can mean “not,” and saru/zaru also puns with “monkey.”
The deeper background is mixed East Asian religion: Japanese Kōshin folk practice, Tendai Buddhism, Shinto context, and probably Chinese Confucian moral language behind it. A similar Confucian formula in the Analects says not to look, listen, speak, or act contrary to propriety. That ethical idea likely traveled into Japan and then got turned into the monkey pun/image.
Originally, the meaning was closer to moral discipline:
Do not look at corrupt things. Do not listen to corrupt things. Do not speak corrupt things.
In some Buddhist-style readings, it means guarding the mind from evil influences. In the Nikkō shrine setting, the monkeys are part of a larger set of panels showing stages of life, not just a cynical joke about ignorance.
The modern Western/business meaning often flips it into something negative:
Pretend not to see problems. Pretend not to hear objections. Refuse to speak uncomfortable truths.
That negative use is common, but applying it specifically to “the Chinese” is sloppy and unfair. It takes a Japanese religious/folk symbol, passes it through a Western cynical interpretation, then uses it as a stereotype about Chinese business culture. That is three layers of distortion.
There is a real business issue people may be gesturing at: in high-context business cultures, people may avoid direct confrontation, preserve face, avoid saying “no” bluntly, or route conflict through indirect signals. That can frustrate Americans or Europeans who expect explicit yes/no answers. But that is not “Chinese people are three monkeys.” It is a communication-style mismatch plus incentives around face, hierarchy, and relationship management.
The clean way to say it in business terms is:
The three monkeys are now often used as a symbol of willful blindness or avoidance. Some Western businesspeople project that onto Chinese negotiation style, but historically the symbol is Japanese and originally moral/religious, not an anti-Chinese business symbol.
Is there a way on how to control how the assemblage point moves or is it just an on/off switch. Like stop internal dialog and assemblage point moves to the required point / or is just stays were it is? What are your best method to stop the internal dialog?
Oh no... It's not an on/off switch.
It's quite analog, and the dial is huge, containing too many tiny increments to count. Each one producing a new effect.
Fortunately you can CERTAINLY control it.
That's the danger of the "red zone" on the J curve.
It's magic supreme!
And you use darkroom rule #2 to manipulate how it moves.
You play with the magic you can see, as if it's real.
So the assemblage point slides horizontally to make it so.
But you can end up in situations as bizarre as sleeping dreams, while you are fully awake and walking around your practice room.
To move it in depth (which is what gets you started), you use darkroom rule #1.
Where if you gaze at anything that "can't possibly be there", and do that with your internal dialogue greatly reduced, your assemblage point begins to move down your back.
What happens is on this map:
https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2Feven-better-j-curve-diagram-v0-9zmf1q8wiyt61.jpg%3Fwidth%3D3592%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D81ad592f1b97f4de6a7a284beaf70e0d26774e55
Best method for learning to stop the internal dialogue, in my opinion, is to face the issue head on, and develop "silence muscles".
It totally sucks, but eventually it becomes easy.
You simple force all words from your mind, with no exceptions, until your nose bleeds from the effort.
So you work like a dog, and then the next time you work even harder.
What's happening in that case, is that your ability to work hard improves.
And you "notice" real magic.
So that one day you realize looking at the magic, also helps.
Unfortunately, stopping the internal dialogue for real is so difficult that no Yogi, Buddhist Master, Daoist or Kabbalist has ever even gotten close.
They just pretend they did, but are too lazy to actually learn to do it.
And are even known to tell followers that "no man can do that".
So they use a substitute like a Koan or Mantra or contemplation.
Which alters it, produces meditative effects, but never gets you far enough to even qualify as a beginner in this subreddit.
On that huge dial, meditation gets you to 0.05 on the scale of super amazing magic.
Barely noticeable.
You need to get to 1.1 on that scale, to see stuff no one will believe.
Wait Dan, are you saying that some zen practices are actually of use?!
Nope. Zen is harmful to people who want to learn sorcery.
It's a complete misunderstanding of reality.
But it's difficult to know what people are talking about, when they say "Zen".
The real thing?
Or the fake westernized version?
Either way, Zen turns you into a powerless Zombie who believes they're better than everyone else.
While claiming you are "empty" and "ego-less".
But their costumes are the best in the fake magic business!
I was referring to the part of doing doing without expecting any kind of reward
Except Zen people do nothing at all without expecting a reward.
So while they're "flipping burgers Zen style", if they aren't seeing tiny people running around on the grill, their assemblage point hasn't moved at all and they're just engaging in Chinese Zombie thinking.
No magic, no real technique being used.
Zen in fact, discourages looking for any actual evidence that their pretending is working.
And when confronted about that, they say "You lie sir."
Meaning, they don't even believe anything real can happen.
It's all supposed to be in some intellectual realm you can't describe.
How disappointing!
It's like pretending you got lunch.
Expectations are insidious. They don't just disappoint. They leave residue. Frustration, doubt, the quiet corrosion of unmet desires. I guess Darkroom is an art to be made for the love of the game.
Remaining fluid, without expectations of what is to come, seems to be the key. Your chances of having a better practice increase when you're in a good mood. Of course, it also matters knowing that on a given day you have high energy levels with momentum behind you, while on other days things feel flat and you simply do your best and accept what comes.
Yesterday I was doing daylight gazing in my room, forcing silence. After some time of gazing I felt my body beginning to fall asleep. I had a strong urge to close my eyes and drift off, but I kept resisting. Throughout all of that resistance I maintained full attention on the felt sense of the experience. I felt something like a heavy object inside me on my back, a center of gravity, dropping suddenly downward, which would jolt me slightly. At times I felt myself vibrating.
During that phase I was seeing amber puffs covering my field of vision, revealing vague humanoid forms. Outlined shapes filled with color, featureless yet moving within them.
Later, through my persistence in keeping my eyes open and maintaining full awareness without moving, following that sensation of "falling down," I felt that heavy center begin to press forward, coming to the front, and at times vibrating forward.
At one point, while still in that state, I saw the emanations. Translucent, faintly white optical fibers with a slightly darker substance vibrating and flowing inside them. In broad daylight. They appeared bundled together but didn't seem to necessarily intertwine with one another. The sight was confined to the area where my eyes had locked. It was as if they materialized out of nowhere in the air of my room. There was a sense of awe, and I thought "yeah, that's them." Yet it was dry and flat, no charge to it. The sight lasted well over 10 seconds before someone came in wanting to talk. I snapped out as they came in starting talking to me, and I only needed to move to come back fully.
Ahhh yesss Athina!!! Well said, and what an experience!!! 🔥🙌🩷
>Your chances of having a better practice increase when you're in a good mood.
Perhaps that's an indication of having "power".
If you don't pursue visible magical effects, but still try to heed the "Men of Knowledge", you might tend to view power, as things going well for you.
But if you immerse yourself into visible magic, that's not something you normally pay attention to.
Although Cholita emphasizes it.
> I was seeing amber puffs
Maybe those are actually the shiny outer coating Carlos wanted us to rise up.
I get golden sparkle clouds, that might easily be viewed as yellow puffs.
And "beings" definitely show up in those. But they clearly aren't inorganic beings.
I also have "black rectangle" visitors when that golden sparkle light is active. They just press against me and then move away.
The "emanations" can show up in several forms. I suppose that makes sense, because they can't actually be viewed like a physical object.
Prompt: Was intent discovered prior to seeing?
Copilot: Short answer
Based on the approved PDFs, the answer is:
No — the texts do not explicitly say that intent was discovered prior to seeing.
However, they present intent as something the ancient sorcerers perceived through seeing, which implies that seeing comes first as the method of discovery.
From the Anthology PDF
The key passage says:
The shamans “focused their seeing on the dark sea of awareness” and then
“found… something they called intent”
This sequence is important:
They already had seeing (a mode of perceiving energy).
Using that seeing, they identified or discovered intent as a distinct mass of energy in the cosmos.
So in this source, the order is:
➡️ seeing (as a capability) → discovery of intent (as an object/force)
From the Compendium PDF
The Compendium does not describe a discovery sequence in the same explicit way.
Instead, it presents intent as:
A pre-existing universal force “out there”
Something practitioners must “hook onto” with energy
It does not state whether:
intent was discovered before seeing
or seeing led to its discovery
So on this specific question, the Compendium is non-committal.
Interpretation (within what the texts support)
From the Anthology alone, the implicit structure is:
Seeing = the tool or perceptual mode
Intent = what is perceived/discovered through it
So while the text does not explicitly say “seeing came before intent,” it clearly describes intent as something revealed by seeing, not preceding it conceptually.
Important caveat
The PDFs do not explicitly frame this as a historical sequence (e.g., “first they discovered seeing, then intent”).
The ordering is inferred only from how the passage is written (seeing → discovery), not from a formal statement about chronology.
Bottom line
The only clear sequence given: ✅ Seeing is already in use when intent is discovered
Therefore: ➤ The texts support that intent was discovered through seeing, not prior to it
If you want, I can trace where seeing itself is first described and how its role evolves relative to intent, will, and the second attention.
(so the Men of Knowledge already were acquainted with intent without knowing about it through seeing. And it makes sense that the intent of the sorcerers of ancient Mexico is likely pre-seers.)
Wow, I'll turn that into a post tomorrow.
Intent becomes more "obvious" once you can stream silent knowledge, because stuff you talked about during the day, or did with some kind of sorcery goal, shows up in the SK streams.
For instance yesterday someone was posting stuff about how everything in sorcery is made of light, and then when I practiced that evening I saw so much light I had to wonder why I had ignored it all before.
But just to keep it more confusing, I had overdosed on sunlight glitter at sunrise that day because the sun was missing for a week before that. And it was a good chance to see the contrast in order to learn more about why sunlight glitter works.
Thus I couldn't be sure what caused it.
But I can absolutely say with authority, you can definitely overdose on sunlight glitter!
And in regards to what "intended" the result, all I could say for sure was that after we discussed light making everything in sorcery, I ended up noticing that myself.
Clearly.
For no reason I could pinpoint with any certainty.
And viewing magic at that SK level daily, one can say for sure that the SK streams have to come from somewhere, which is most likely latent awareness glowing in the emanations.
So that if you "intend" something just right, that generates or uncovers a latent awareness accumulation in the emanations.
Without one of those, you just get random SK streams which are generated from weaker latent awareness collections.
Some things just can't be figured out, until you are face to face with them daily. Such as SK stream rules.
I'll use my "wealthy uncle" analogy to show our situation.
You have to have a wealthy uncle, before you can figure out the rules of which gifts he gives his nieces and nephews.
Here's why women are better at sorcery.
The little boy is mostly going to take his gift and bash someone over the head with it, to get more attention.
While the girl tries to figure out how to control the uncle.
Wow! Awesome!