And he was accompanied by his wife who, naturally, went deeper than he did.
Additionally McKenna considered that doing mushrooms every 4 days for a 20 day period was too extreme.
I wonder what he would have said about being deep in the second attention for hours a night, every night! And also into the next day!
Edit: and the IOB's are just as keen on demonic laughter from the woods as a spooky visual apparition.
[-]
u/higgsbison312
2 points2021-07-06 01:51
From what I remember DJ and later Castaneda used cold water to "restore perceptual balance".
DJ had to put Castaneda in the irrigation ditch after he smoked the mixture. Another time after Don Genaro and Don Juan "split" him by talking into each of his ears at the same time, which is a pretty cool story in itself:
Something in me must have ceased at a given moment; perhaps my awareness of being talked to. I sensed that don Genaro was still with me, yet from the point of view of my perception I could only distinguish an enormous mass of the most extraordinary lights. At times their glare diminished and at times the lights became intense. I was also experiencing movement. The effect was like being pulled by a vacuum that never let me stop. Whenever my motion seemed to diminish and I could actually focus my awareness on the lights, the vacuum would pull me away again.
At one moment, between being pulled back and forth, I experienced the ultimate confusion. The world around me, whatever it was, was coming and going at the same time, thus the vacuum like effect. I could see two separate worlds; one that was going away from me and the other that was coming closer to me. I did not realize this as one ordinarily would; that is, I did not become aware of it as something that had thus far been unrevealed. I rather had two realizations without the unifying conclusion.
There is something in cold water that stabilized the AP, it even helps me with hangovers haha. Not sure about the mechanics of it, but it works somehow.
[-]
u/danl999
6 points2021-07-06 15:38
I was doing what's described here for 2 hours last night.
I was trying to figure out the visual difference between left and right side awareness.
When it comes to the "left side awareness", you will probably think there's some complicated procedure to access it.
But in fact, you just look that direction.
We're divided down the middle in some weird way, and if you become silent enough to see energy, you can study that division.
It's pure heaven. The first thing you'll be thinking is, how can I stay here all the time?
(Thinking without words).
I was tempted to draw it up today, but it's too abstract to explain.
Imagine this: You're looking at the perfectly dark room, but nothing in front of you is dark. There's endless little zig-zag lines and dots, in red and purple, superimposed over some background color you simply can't define.
I'm thinking they're "microbundles" or something similar. The emanations as a clump, but it's only a clump of a tiny amount of them. So for a very bizarre example, maybe it could be the ear lobe of a person, if you gazed at it and force it to take shape. Or if you skimmed it, maybe it can also be the toenail of a reptile.
But the range of things that little clump can become is limited.
By sweeping the head to find the clumps, and gazing to make them form, you can select a reality to assemble.
When you turn the head left, you see the same thing, except that if you try to figure out the details and what they might be, they begin to form into dreams fairly quickly.
If you glance to the right and try the same the dreams don't form as fast . But there's some "shapeshifter" sensation on that side. As if the left goes into consciousness, and the right goes into activity.
However, I was facing east, so the left was north, and right south. And we don't yet know enough about the directions and their effects.
We need a group of seers! Imagine picking a "topic" of the week, and asking our seers to investigate it and compare the results.
Fun, fun, fun!
If you glance straight down the middle of your awareness, trying to use peripheral vision to see both at once, the bliss is so soothing that you keep finding yourself lost.
It's impossible to have problems in that state, because there's no "self" to suffer.
But you can still get lost meaning, you forgot to keep forcing the silence. So the assemblage point is being tugged back to normal (slowly).
When you try to figure out if you stopped being silent as a result, you find yourself covered in purple fuzz. Not a pretty purple fuzz. A dirty, hazy, static filled purple and black haze.
It's self-reflection!
As you gaze straight in perfect silence, trying to see the energy on each side, self-reflection shows up in the middle.
Always in the middle, is what I was thinking at the time. True or not I don't know, but it sort of makes sense. If you're going to block out both sides, without stretching entirely over them, the middle is the best place to set a trap for the attention.
So you encounter the self-reflection blob, sink in a bit, and get stuck in the muck.
Eventually the internal dialogue will come back if you stay there.
Since it's self-reflection, you can still perceive the energy through the silence but you force it to form into images of "you", and "them", and what you did.
Self-reflection creates it's own virtual universe, and almost nothing from the outside can penetrate it. So we become blind to the pure energy and what it might have formed, instead lost in an imaginary swamp of self-pity and suffering.
Newbies: When I say self-pity and suffering, that's you. I know you've been programmed to react badly to that statement, because it's part of our social myth to assume a certain amount of suffering is normal, and anyone who speaks of it is not doing right.
But in fact, we're drowning in suffering. And we've been taught to pretend we're Rambo, and ignore that we've been shot 6 times all over our body.
Bottom line: Find the coolest story from the books, and YOU can do that too.
It's not even hard.
It just takes work, that's all.
You don't have to be good at the work, or talented.
You just have to do it every day.
Maybe the tonal gives up, once it's obvious you aren't going to stop.
Here's something from Facebook to show why the community is too lost.
I was teaching them seeing, and a troublesome older woman who "leads" groups insisted her intuition was seeing too.
I suppose you could say that, but the potential to lie to yourself is infinite. Probably this idea that intuition is seeing also, came from phony naguals.
In fact, if there isn't a second attention content, it is not seeing.
I called her out on it, hoping I'd come in today and see that she's willing to do some work, and change.
But she only wants me to endorse her on my Facebook page, a common thing. Here's what she said, obviously retreating back into the purple blob of self-reflection, to block out the real world.
*********
we are not important. Neither you nor I, nor carlos are important. Carlos was not the center of the world and he did not think he was.
no one is better than anyone else and no one has the right to judge the abilities of anyone else. When we experience teachers who have not helped us, we simply leave them.
i have very long zen buddhism experience and have meditated with monks and learned bow shooting and taichi and my experience is that they are very much related to intention.
i have no reason to tell anyone anything that does not correspond to the fact, i do not want to please you or anyone else. Then I would not have done my job as a WARRIOR.
i look and i see and i marvel.
[-]
u/the-mad-prophet
4 points2021-07-06 02:57
Cold water definitely wakes you up! My ex from years ago was into cold showers in the morning. Better than several cups of coffee and without the caffeine hangover too. Definitely works but can’t say I enjoy them, and definitely not in winter.
It might be very different for hot water. I started seeing purple puffs while having hot baths. There might be something about being suspended in hot still water that is a bit different.
[-]
u/TechnoMagical_Intent
1 points2021-07-06 12:54
Just disregard the UFO and Mantis Alien stuff (very minimally mentioned in the clip). These are simply his amusing interpretations of the IOB's he and his wife were perceiving together.
People who lack a framework for contextualizing their experiences, because they got to those a.p. positions with the external aid of substances, come off as rather clueless at times (sorry to any psychonauts who are reading this).
When you don't get there on your own/with intent you don't see how things develop from precursors, so you're forced to rely on first attention inventory to make sense of things after the fact....because it's difficult to bring enough reason into the experience as it's happening , since you ceded control to the entheogen.
I don't know if there are any entheogens that produce specific and reliable positions of the a.p. that would enable repeated examination of that state, and thus solve the cluelessness.
The experiences I've read indicate it's almost always chaotic and a one-off, at least when going solo.
[-]
u/selftransforming
1 points2021-07-06 13:37
I think another part of the issue with entheogens is that they move the a.p. so fast. With a solid experiential understanding beforehand, and also lots of time spent under the influence of the specific entheogen, a person could understand what's happening, but then I think you've pretty much got a "man of knowledge" primed up...
[-]
u/danl999
6 points2021-07-06 15:29
That guy give me the creeps.
What did he have to say about water?
Little Smoke and Devil's weed chased me all over Asia around 10 years ago, and at the time I hadn't figured out I just need to stand up to them. I got chased into the bathtub a few times.
One time they caught me before I could get into it, and I had to flee out the door and down the very long hallway of an expensive hotel in Shanghai.
I kept hoping someone would be in the halls and I could find out if they could see them too.
But the hallways were completely empty.
That was almost as unusual as being chased.
If anyone else gets chased, just stop, turn to face them, and say, "Ok, you got me. Now what?"
[-]
u/TechnoMagical_Intent
2 points2021-07-06 16:23
YouTube generated transcript, are you a speed reader?
we had one other experience that was pretty strange that's told in true hallucinations i tell it because i guess you should know this but kat and i were in hawaii one time in this little uh way out on this lava flow and we've been taking mushrooms pretty steadily like twice a week or so and if you do that if you really want your world to come apart take mushrooms every four days for 20 days and i guarantee you you'll be pleading for mercy at the end of it because things will have gotten so weird so anyway we were out on this lava flow and we took mushrooms and it was the third trip and i got into this we were inside and i got into this dialogue with the thing on the subject of i always it's part of every trip almost is this i want you to do something i want you to give a sign in 3d i want you to show me something in 3d and then we got into this wrangle about the propulsion system of the flying saucer and i was saying you know i want to seethe ship and he was saying if we show you the ship you'll understand how it works and i'm saying look i'm the grower don't hold out on me and this thing was going back and forth and about that time cat tugged on my arm and said i feel very very hot and i have to go outside so it was a great effort for both of us to move outside we could barely stand and we got outside she kept she could not maintain her consciousness he kept like fainting which i'd never seen this and um you know i was very loaded but i i it shouldn't have been happening and and then i went through this thing you know who you going to call the famous question who you're going to call and realizing there's no one on this island who knows anything about this except me and i don't know anything about it and i'm you know slapping her around come out of it come out of it and she can but then she loses it again and it slowly dawned on me actually not so slowly but like over about five seconds that she was going to die that i had finally done it and i had pushed myself into this situation and this thing was going to happen and i actually saw it like unfolding in my mind i saw myself carrying her into the forest and sitting with her while she died we had no car we had no telephone did nothing and and then as i ran this movie again of me walking with her into the woods i saw myself walking past the overflow trough from the rain catchment system that gathers water and i thought i'll put her in water and i stood up to take her and i was so smashed and it was just a sea of hallucination and i had a pair of drawstring pants i remember that came loose and fell down around my ankles so i had my pants around my ankles and i was carrying this woman frankenstein style back through the darkness and she's absolutely out and and we get back to the trough to this thing and i lay her down on the ground and i pick up a bucket of water and just let her have it you know and then another one and then i i realize that i figured it out and that she's going to live and that this was the thing to do and she's now talking tome and saying you know do it do more it's burning me make every part of my body cold and wet and so maybe 30 seconds has elapsed and now i'm down on the ground in the mud embracing her she's hysterical we're both laughing and crying all this thing and the forest edge is just about from me to you right there and suddenly from within the forest comes this sound of the most crazed demonic laughter you can possibly imagine i mean hollywood eat your heart out it was just absolutely appalling and we just grabbed each other and ran for the house and um it was it was never explained what it was but somehow she had gotten more loaded than i think she had broken through to some place i've never been on mushrooms because after i brought her into the house i still i drew a bath and i kept putting her into beds and taking her out and she would go into these and i said what's happening what's happening and she said ferns are growing out of everything everything is putting off and with my three-dimensional hallucinations with eyes open so it was a case i think of just getting very very deeply into it what was happening for her in those periods when i was slapping her around and trying to wake her up was she could see hovering over the house far larger than the house itself a structure made out of rods of light in which the shovel-faced mantis-like creatures were there and she said they felt like hyperdimensional pirates they were not part of the mushroom the mushroom she said was appalled that we all had been we all had run across some roving bad guys and the mushroom was saying you know let's all just hunker down here and be quiet for a few minutes and these guys will go on stories lots of stories
And as far as vividness and weirdness, I surpass that nearly every night these days.
I just don't post it because there's no "lesson" in it for anyone else.
Why anyone would rely on drugs is beyond me. They aren't more powerful, they don't produce better "trips", they distort your personality in ways every single person who meets you will instantly see, and they leave you prey to manipulative people.
10 Comments
Title: "Terence McKenna Encounters Hyper-Dimensional Pirates"
And he was accompanied by his wife who, naturally, went deeper than he did.
Additionally McKenna considered that doing mushrooms every 4 days for a 20 day period was too extreme.
I wonder what he would have said about being deep in the second attention for hours a night, every night! And also into the next day!
Edit: and the IOB's are just as keen on demonic laughter from the woods as a spooky visual apparition.
From what I remember DJ and later Castaneda used cold water to "restore perceptual balance".
DJ had to put Castaneda in the irrigation ditch after he smoked the mixture. Another time after Don Genaro and Don Juan "split" him by talking into each of his ears at the same time, which is a pretty cool story in itself:
There is something in cold water that stabilized the AP, it even helps me with hangovers haha. Not sure about the mechanics of it, but it works somehow.
I was doing what's described here for 2 hours last night.
I was trying to figure out the visual difference between left and right side awareness.
When it comes to the "left side awareness", you will probably think there's some complicated procedure to access it.
But in fact, you just look that direction.
We're divided down the middle in some weird way, and if you become silent enough to see energy, you can study that division.
It's pure heaven. The first thing you'll be thinking is, how can I stay here all the time?
(Thinking without words).
I was tempted to draw it up today, but it's too abstract to explain.
Imagine this: You're looking at the perfectly dark room, but nothing in front of you is dark. There's endless little zig-zag lines and dots, in red and purple, superimposed over some background color you simply can't define.
I'm thinking they're "microbundles" or something similar. The emanations as a clump, but it's only a clump of a tiny amount of them. So for a very bizarre example, maybe it could be the ear lobe of a person, if you gazed at it and force it to take shape. Or if you skimmed it, maybe it can also be the toenail of a reptile.
But the range of things that little clump can become is limited.
By sweeping the head to find the clumps, and gazing to make them form, you can select a reality to assemble.
When you turn the head left, you see the same thing, except that if you try to figure out the details and what they might be, they begin to form into dreams fairly quickly.
If you glance to the right and try the same the dreams don't form as fast . But there's some "shapeshifter" sensation on that side. As if the left goes into consciousness, and the right goes into activity.
However, I was facing east, so the left was north, and right south. And we don't yet know enough about the directions and their effects.
We need a group of seers! Imagine picking a "topic" of the week, and asking our seers to investigate it and compare the results.
Fun, fun, fun!
If you glance straight down the middle of your awareness, trying to use peripheral vision to see both at once, the bliss is so soothing that you keep finding yourself lost.
It's impossible to have problems in that state, because there's no "self" to suffer.
But you can still get lost meaning, you forgot to keep forcing the silence. So the assemblage point is being tugged back to normal (slowly).
When you try to figure out if you stopped being silent as a result, you find yourself covered in purple fuzz. Not a pretty purple fuzz. A dirty, hazy, static filled purple and black haze.
It's self-reflection!
As you gaze straight in perfect silence, trying to see the energy on each side, self-reflection shows up in the middle.
Always in the middle, is what I was thinking at the time. True or not I don't know, but it sort of makes sense. If you're going to block out both sides, without stretching entirely over them, the middle is the best place to set a trap for the attention.
So you encounter the self-reflection blob, sink in a bit, and get stuck in the muck.
Eventually the internal dialogue will come back if you stay there.
Since it's self-reflection, you can still perceive the energy through the silence but you force it to form into images of "you", and "them", and what you did.
Self-reflection creates it's own virtual universe, and almost nothing from the outside can penetrate it. So we become blind to the pure energy and what it might have formed, instead lost in an imaginary swamp of self-pity and suffering.
Newbies: When I say self-pity and suffering, that's you. I know you've been programmed to react badly to that statement, because it's part of our social myth to assume a certain amount of suffering is normal, and anyone who speaks of it is not doing right.
But in fact, we're drowning in suffering. And we've been taught to pretend we're Rambo, and ignore that we've been shot 6 times all over our body.
Bottom line: Find the coolest story from the books, and YOU can do that too.
It's not even hard.
It just takes work, that's all.
You don't have to be good at the work, or talented.
You just have to do it every day.
Maybe the tonal gives up, once it's obvious you aren't going to stop.
Here's something from Facebook to show why the community is too lost.
I was teaching them seeing, and a troublesome older woman who "leads" groups insisted her intuition was seeing too.
I suppose you could say that, but the potential to lie to yourself is infinite. Probably this idea that intuition is seeing also, came from phony naguals.
In fact, if there isn't a second attention content, it is not seeing.
I called her out on it, hoping I'd come in today and see that she's willing to do some work, and change.
But she only wants me to endorse her on my Facebook page, a common thing. Here's what she said, obviously retreating back into the purple blob of self-reflection, to block out the real world.
*********
Cold water definitely wakes you up! My ex from years ago was into cold showers in the morning. Better than several cups of coffee and without the caffeine hangover too. Definitely works but can’t say I enjoy them, and definitely not in winter.
It might be very different for hot water. I started seeing purple puffs while having hot baths. There might be something about being suspended in hot still water that is a bit different.
Just disregard the UFO and Mantis Alien stuff (very minimally mentioned in the clip). These are simply his amusing interpretations of the IOB's he and his wife were perceiving together.
People who lack a framework for contextualizing their experiences, because they got to those a.p. positions with the external aid of substances, come off as rather clueless at times (sorry to any psychonauts who are reading this).
When you don't get there on your own/with intent you don't see how things develop from precursors, so you're forced to rely on first attention inventory to make sense of things after the fact....because it's difficult to bring enough reason into the experience as it's happening , since you ceded control to the entheogen.
I don't know if there are any entheogens that produce specific and reliable positions of the a.p. that would enable repeated examination of that state, and thus solve the cluelessness.
The experiences I've read indicate it's almost always chaotic and a one-off, at least when going solo.
I think another part of the issue with entheogens is that they move the a.p. so fast. With a solid experiential understanding beforehand, and also lots of time spent under the influence of the specific entheogen, a person could understand what's happening, but then I think you've pretty much got a "man of knowledge" primed up...
That guy give me the creeps.
What did he have to say about water?
Little Smoke and Devil's weed chased me all over Asia around 10 years ago, and at the time I hadn't figured out I just need to stand up to them. I got chased into the bathtub a few times.
One time they caught me before I could get into it, and I had to flee out the door and down the very long hallway of an expensive hotel in Shanghai.
I kept hoping someone would be in the halls and I could find out if they could see them too.
But the hallways were completely empty.
That was almost as unusual as being chased.
If anyone else gets chased, just stop, turn to face them, and say, "Ok, you got me. Now what?"
YouTube generated transcript, are you a speed reader?
we had one other experience that was pretty strange that's told in true hallucinations i tell it because i guess you should know this but kat and i were in hawaii one time in this little uh way out on this lava flow and we've been taking mushrooms pretty steadily like twice a week or so and if you do that if you really want your world to come apart take mushrooms every four days for 20 days and i guarantee you you'll be pleading for mercy at the end of it because things will have gotten so weird so anyway we were out on this lava flow and we took mushrooms and it was the third trip and i got into this we were inside and i got into this dialogue with the thing on the subject of i always it's part of every trip almost is this i want you to do something i want you to give a sign in 3d i want you to show me something in 3d and then we got into this wrangle about the propulsion system of the flying saucer and i was saying you know i want to seethe ship and he was saying if we show you the ship you'll understand how it works and i'm saying look i'm the grower don't hold out on me and this thing was going back and forth and about that time cat tugged on my arm and said i feel very very hot and i have to go outside so it was a great effort for both of us to move outside we could barely stand and we got outside she kept she could not maintain her consciousness he kept like fainting which i'd never seen this and um you know i was very loaded but i i it shouldn't have been happening and and then i went through this thing you know who you going to call the famous question who you're going to call and realizing there's no one on this island who knows anything about this except me and i don't know anything about it and i'm you know slapping her around come out of it come out of it and she can but then she loses it again and it slowly dawned on me actually not so slowly but like over about five seconds that she was going to die that i had finally done it and i had pushed myself into this situation and this thing was going to happen and i actually saw it like unfolding in my mind i saw myself carrying her into the forest and sitting with her while she died we had no car we had no telephone did nothing and and then as i ran this movie again of me walking with her into the woods i saw myself walking past the overflow trough from the rain catchment system that gathers water and i thought i'll put her in water and i stood up to take her and i was so smashed and it was just a sea of hallucination and i had a pair of drawstring pants i remember that came loose and fell down around my ankles so i had my pants around my ankles and i was carrying this woman frankenstein style back through the darkness and she's absolutely out and and we get back to the trough to this thing and i lay her down on the ground and i pick up a bucket of water and just let her have it you know and then another one and then i i realize that i figured it out and that she's going to live and that this was the thing to do and she's now talking tome and saying you know do it do more it's burning me make every part of my body cold and wet and so maybe 30 seconds has elapsed and now i'm down on the ground in the mud embracing her she's hysterical we're both laughing and crying all this thing and the forest edge is just about from me to you right there and suddenly from within the forest comes this sound of the most crazed demonic laughter you can possibly imagine i mean hollywood eat your heart out it was just absolutely appalling and we just grabbed each other and ran for the house and um it was it was never explained what it was but somehow she had gotten more loaded than i think she had broken through to some place i've never been on mushrooms because after i brought her into the house i still i drew a bath and i kept putting her into beds and taking her out and she would go into these and i said what's happening what's happening and she said ferns are growing out of everything everything is putting off and with my three-dimensional hallucinations with eyes open so it was a case i think of just getting very very deeply into it what was happening for her in those periods when i was slapping her around and trying to wake her up was she could see hovering over the house far larger than the house itself a structure made out of rods of light in which the shovel-faced mantis-like creatures were there and she said they felt like hyperdimensional pirates they were not part of the mushroom the mushroom she said was appalled that we all had been we all had run across some roving bad guys and the mushroom was saying you know let's all just hunker down here and be quiet for a few minutes and these guys will go on stories lots of stories
Beep. Boop. I'm a robot.
Here's a copy of
Frankenstein
Was I a good bot? | info | More Books
Wow. What a mess.
And as far as vividness and weirdness, I surpass that nearly every night these days.
I just don't post it because there's no "lesson" in it for anyone else.
Why anyone would rely on drugs is beyond me. They aren't more powerful, they don't produce better "trips", they distort your personality in ways every single person who meets you will instantly see, and they leave you prey to manipulative people.
Like his wife.