New Practitionersu/[deleted]2022-06-08 19:59 UTC12 pointsdeleted
[deleted]
19 Comments
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u/[deleted]
1 points2022-06-08 19:59deleted
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u/TechnoMagical_Intent
7 points2022-06-08 20:11
I’m from a similar background. Except I had no expectations before reading the first book.
Hopes. But no expectations.
And after, I very much realized I was hooked…but still did the survey/review thing for years.
I had the benefit of not having consistent/at home Internet access, so I didn’t do so much as a peek of the search term “Carlos Castaneda” until some months after reading the books on my own.
But things weren't really all that toxic, Castaneda-wise, on the Internet until around 2007 or so. Right around the time the iPhone came out 🧐.
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u/danl999
8 points2022-06-08 21:37
The only teaching that's worked though human history as far as we know, is young children given to the old seers 8000 years ago. Like our guy who's merged with Carol Tiggs. He was given as a small child.
It's like Yoda says, "Too old to begin the training he is."
I firmly believe those are from the witch Soledad, from the books. She was working in Hollywood for years or decades, probably using the lineage's accumulated wealth of close to 800 years. Fabulous art works they had. All needed to go when the lineage ended.
You could teach sorcery to a child. Easily in fact!
But to an adult, is not possible.
No one can teach sorcery to an individual. If you stick around here, you'll see it's true.
The lineages were not the same as trying to teach an individual. They tricked them, using 15 other sorcerers.
With 15 real sorcerers and a trick to keep the apprentice around, you just slap their back into heightened awareness and teach that way. When they return to normal, they don't remember.
So all you have to do is keep them amused with stories and fun outdoor activities.
As for individuals, I tried for 20 years after Carlos died. Couldn't teach a single one. Some even wasted 10 years of my time.
Carlos also failed to teach even a single person, as far as I know. And if he did, shame on them for letting things get so bad that all the search results said Carlos was a fake.
BUT, you can take a group of 500, do your best to motivate them, and let the one who has the time, is actually interested in real magic, and has no family or social life holding them back, succeed.
We get 1 in 500 is my guess.
In the long run.
But just to move the assemblage point and see real magic for the first time in their lives, we might get 1 in 100.
And so we have around 50 now.
So what I'm telling you is, it's up to you. No one in here can teach you.
Work hard, and try to use the least amount of the more experienced people's time on things that don't help anyone.
Don't visit (much), don't speculate, don't bring in outside shit. If you stop working, then stop commenting. Don't "hang out". It's very harmful to others.
We have only this last chance to save magic.
And how long we can save it for, is questionable. We come under endless attack.
Like today.
This place will be wiped out if we aren't careful.
In your case, you need to force yourself silent and learn to move the assemblage point.
Nothing else is going to keep you going.
Don't find an excuse to "work on something else".
You need to see "the real thing", because it's so much work to learn to get silent.
And unfortunately, even seeing real magic isn't enough to keep people going because there's no "company" out there.
It's very cold, practicing the real thing.
No one can follow you into infinity.
Except Cholita...
I got lucky.
There may be a few other of the women who could do that.
But we aren't there yet.
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u/Jiraiya_ROFL
2 points2022-06-08 21:51
Would you say one can’t become a sorcerer if he is married with kids?
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u/tabdrops
2 points2022-06-08 22:36
Would you say such doubts could be a suitable intent to become a sorcerer?
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u/danl999
5 points2022-06-08 23:07
We might want to "survey" anyone who makes it to silent knowledge on a reliable basis.
To find out what the commonality is.
How long did they actually work, as opposed to how long they said they worked.
And whether they stopped a while and returned after a break.
And how badly being all alone in that practice felt.
It's unique in that you can't share it at all. You'll get lynched.
You spend an hour in heaven chatting up God, and you can't tell anyone. They don't want to hear it.
They don't even care that you erected a giant freeway overpass in your bedroom, so you could stage insurance fraud.
I just don't get it...
It would also be interesting to see how often the people who make it to SK encountered inorganic beings.
I'm pretty much up to my ears in them. If I don't see one 20 times in a night, I'm feeling cheated.
I sent one to wake up a witch last night. It was like sending "Lassie" to save little Timmy from the mine shaft he got trapped in.
"Come here Lassie!!! Go wake up the witch. Yes, the witch. That'll be fun Lassie!"
And it did!
It even came back to make a lame excuse for a few seconds. Like Lassie returning to tell you the mine shaft has collapsed.
So you say, "Then dig Lassie, Dig!!!"
It actually wanted "permission" I suppose. The witch wasn't paying attention to him, so more drastic measures were required.
I wish I knew what as up with the permission thing.
Oh, and it was Minx.
I had to say that, or face him tonight.
Minx said I should stop dissing him in here.
Seeing as how he might decide to help us.
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u/monkeyguy999
5 points2022-06-09 03:27
Did you send minx or ask minx to go?
Permission is a bit odd with IOBs. I've noticed that what they consider permission does not always equate to what a modern human considers "permission".
Thus, minx needed "your"? permission or a humans permission? to take it to the next level?
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u/danl999
3 points2022-06-09 16:33
The witch gave me permission, so i looked for minx, and surprisingly, he showed up.
At first, he was just there to cause trouble, the way he does in Cholita's phantom house.
He was running around pretending to "help" me find the binoculars.
But he got hooked on the energy of the Tunnel. And Cholita made a couple of rare appearances, remote viewing me from elsewhere.
I suppose Minx also has Cholita's permission.
But Cholita will "extract payment" for my use of Minx.
So I've been distracting her with shrubbery for her garden.
She punishes me if she uses the shrubbery by tossing something I've been using out. Like the hose I got, so I didn't disturb her complicated arrangement of hoses.
Or the spray nosil I use, so she can't detect me watering plants when she's not there.
Cholita isn't careful about making sure her plants have enough water. She has "rules of watering", which apply to ordinary dirt in pots.
Not to high quality potting soil, which is best watered each day.
She tosses out garden related stuff of mine, so that her liking my plant choices doesn't go to my head.
Speaking of "permission", I was seeing if I could move all the way to silent knowledge just after waking up before it was time to go shower this morning, if I didn't turn the lights on.
And I succeeded!
An IOB, possibly Fancy, showed up to make me an offer.
I told her, "Sure, that sounds good. Let's do that."
Then I realized, in some demented IOB thought process that might be permission to kidnap me.
I had to add, "As long as it doesn't trap me anywhere."
You really do have to be careful it seems. I was in SK territory, so the worry was actually a tiny piece of silent knowledge.
Don't agree to gifts or visits anywhere, unless you think first if there might be "permission" hidden in there.
Don't pick up objects in their world either. I suppose that could be taken as stealing from them, and worthy of incarceration?
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u/hanskey
1 points2022-06-10 00:12
Picking up on your speculation about stealing might be what they are reacting to - it could be another reason the lineage encourages one to get rid of "concern," and that difficult to understand balance of abandon without being stupid+death-seeking. I wanna call it strategic abandon, or maybe someone else did and I've forgotten.
Obviously concern is eliminated during inner-silence, but what about the role of concern in the story of Carol and Carlos when they ended up in the IOB realm together, yet did not put on those clothes?
If they hadn't mastered the setting aside of concern for their physical bodies appropriately where it didn't make sense, like the IOB realm, then they probably put on the clothes purely automatically, out of habit and concern for their nakedness.
The IOBs are obliged to push us to enhance awareness just as we are obligated to push everything around us to enhance awareness, and tricks like that are, perhaps among other things, a test of how far the human has evolved, and if it's not far enough to dodge what should be an easy test (I say easy because concerns about the physical self are irrelevant in the IOB realm - the physical self isn't even there), then they keep the human but only until the human overcomes certain concerns about existing? Then, perhaps women never get trapped because of their more developed capacity to let go and why the death defier's trick really worked.
Just a thought!
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u/the-mad-prophet
7 points2022-06-09 04:14
The permission thing is weird. I've had it come up before but I don't really understand the nuances to it.
Perhaps it is something to do with intent. We are giving them our intent to do something and they can act on that? Or some kind of energetic resources. 'Like, yes, I could theoretically haunt that guy who stole your money, but I can't actually do it without permission - which is you directing me to who he is and where I can find him.'
Maybe it's just weird IOB etiquette..
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u/danl999
4 points2022-06-09 16:47
My tunnel project partner and I have both concluded, maybe I now have a right to "give her to the IOBs".
So I need to be careful.
Wasn't it Rosario who gave Elias and Amalia to the IOBs by accident?
Except his "accident" was to gift wrap them in a box, and hand them over.
Not much of an "accident".
I suspect he just didn't really expect that to work.
Maybe he thought the IOBs would just visit them more, to help him teach.
But they couldn't resist snatching them completely.
New theory on that.
Humans cannot teleport their physical matter on their own.
they can "shrink it", and fully switch to the double.
But I don't myself believe, they can "wake up at the other end".
Without assistance to move the "shrunk Tonal".
Its' just a theory.
But it partly comes from "The Caretaker" of that transportation complex I visit nightly.
He implied it was no problem for the earth to move your physical matter along with your dream bubble (energy body).
Because it's a HUGE inorganic being.
And we know, IOBS can move stuff. I've seen it up close!
And don Juan said, the IOBs first kidnap the double.
Then later they send more of their friends to snatch the physical matter.
So the "theory" makes a little sense.
The earth is how sorcerers move both.
Just a theory...
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u/danl999
7 points2022-06-08 22:54
You can do the all day silence thing, and sunlight outdoor gazing during lunch or breaks.
So no, you can definitely do it!
I'm not sure what the problem is. Why so few will make an effort.
100 come in here, only one actually puts in some work for long enough to get to the green zone reliably.
And we're not talking impossible amounts of work.
It's no more than if you played basketball with your buddies in the evening.
Or if you loved night time scuba diving.
Or if you decided to join a las Vegas lounge band, and had never played the trumpet before.
2 or 3 hours a day.
But crap magic things like Monroe train you to think you can just make up stuff about your dreams and get the attention, even if you never actually get any real magic.
And meditation systems tell you that you only need 20 minutes in the evening, and 20 minutes in the morning.
We've been trained that "magic isn't worth much." And of course, pretend magic isn't.
But there will eventually come a time when you can leave your darkroom like you were traveling into the mountains.
Then it becomes very alluring. At that point, time is NOT the issue. Practice substitutes for sleep way out there on the J curve.
The problem then is dreaming energy.
I don't know what happens if you have a family at that point.
But when you gain that much skill, the wife will absorb it. Might even learn to go along with you.
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u/[deleted]
2 points2022-06-09 23:43deleted
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u/danl999
3 points2022-06-10 14:25
He was an evil bastard?
But there's no way you are able to understand that. You're probably living in pretend magic land, with a side dish of "scientific reasoning".
I could use an analogy to help you understand.
Lets say there was a mountain where if you searched well, you could find your own gold mine.
It was known far and wide as "Gold Mountain!"
But oddly, it took too much searching and so far only a very few found their own gold mine.
Monroe came along and was interested, but far too lazy to do all that searching.
And yet, he noticed all the profit potential among fans of Gold Mountain.
So he sold fake maps, to pretend gold mines. And then set up a "gold certification" program, with "gold expert" degrees.
He not only cheated people by cashing in on the fans of Gold Mountain, but he thought up a way to silence people who pointed out their "gold" was just a pyrite.
He "certified it". And taught them to accept crappy pyrite to boot, explaining how they needed to "visualize" it.
That's how Buddhism works too. They lie and promise magic, and lie and say the Buddha's meditation powers were advanced.
When he was just a crappy beginner with some crummy scribes willing to exaggerate his accomplishments, and weave older writings into it to make it seem wise.
But it's also a huge system with amazing temples, "Dali Lamas", and all sorts of "certifications" you could earn, to get lots of attention from others. You even get to sit on a little throne, and go into business for yourself.
So devoted buddhists (of meditation) are "lost". They will never escape that self-absorbed prison.
Monroe created one of those too, so he could cash in on Carlos.
And anyone who follows his path too far, will NEVER learn sorcery.
Which is utterly amazing. We have real magic, in your face, for hours a day if you can find the time. Magic so astounding, monroe fans won't even believe or comprehend it.
They "gloss". If you describe what we do, they remember a nightmare they had 5 years ago, and try to equate it to what we do day in and day out, for hours each time.
Someone has to remind them, "Uh... We do all this with our eyes open. And not once every thousand years."
They don't even have honesty going for them.
Monroe teaches them to make up stuff to get attention. And then "certifies" it.
Last night I was wandering around 100,000 year old ruins left by proto-humans who practiced sorcery.
For real!
And let me remind you, in case you are a Monroe fan, I was fully awake with my eyes open. Not making up stuff about bad dreams disturbed by Monroes "techniques".
In fact, I walked past the walls of my bedroom. Not laying in bed pretending. I literally walked in my physical body, outside the limits of the room.
A strange woman came to help me learn something about them, possibly after traveling 6000 miles to a witch I work with, to borrow some of her dark energy.
It might have been a "Golem" being.
Bottom line: Monroe was a very bad man, and whoever took over for him is also.
Just one of hundreds "riding on the back of Carlos Castaneda", to steal from others.
But how did you end up in here?
I can't keep track of user ids.
We had an attack by Monroe zombies this week.
Was it from my comments on Youtube?
I'll keep doing that, until Monroe Institute is known to be harmful to people.
It's long overdue.
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u/AC011422
1 points2022-06-11 02:03
I saw your rant about Monroe on the astralprojection subreddit. Not sure why you'd assume I'm some closed-minded follower for asking a simple question.
I ask because I don't understand the hate. I read his first book and listened to his tapes and got into the astral in around two weeks. More on that later.
I am a little intrigued by Carlos Castaneda, but mostly for... ironic reasons. Let's just say that even just looking at his first book's cover makes the world feel very dreamlike. You see, I have Yaqui blood, as well as Wintu. I know for sure my Wintu heritage is through at least two successive healers, shamans - whatever you want to call them. My Yaqui background is more mysterious because my great grandfather abandoned his Wintu wife and their son when my grandfather was a baby, so my grandfather was raised only by his Wintu family.
But that's not the interesting part.
Both my mother and I... I guess inherited non-physical Indian friends. Hers were her "witch friends" and mine had specific names that I don't feel like sharing right now.
Mine hung around with me when I was three. I have several clear memories of them and a whole lot of not so clear ones.
They didn't say much. One didn't talk at all. The one that didn't talk was neither male or female and had waist-length hair that covered its back, and its face. I only saw its face once after a long time of pestering it about it, and it was unpleasant to say the least.
Anyway, they would sometimes take me to "visit family." There was a wooden well house like a shed outside our house and they would guide me to the wall where we'd walk through it and appear inside a small white house in the middle of the desert where four or more Indians lived. This happened multiple times. The Indians knew who I was but I had no idea who they were. Looking back, I think they were dead.
There's more to all this but this is all I feel like sharing.
Let's just say that I have a past that supports your belief in real magic. It is indeed real. I have even been able to remote view into my past and look at these beings from any angle I want. They're as real as anyone, but made of light rather than physical matter, if that makes sense.
In more recent times - a month ago - while trying to astral project in a car, just beyond the hypnagogic, my mind completely silent, I did something that I don't think was necessarily astral projecting, but I'm not sure what it was (maybe you have an explanation). My mind was 100% void of chatter, and I was floating in a void as colorful as the colors in a soap bubble. In it were two beings that were the same colors as their surroundings, lots of greens, purples, pinks, and they were discussing their annoyance at my sudden intrusion. I was all but unconscious, although I was listening. One asked the other if he knew me, and when they realized neither did, they started discussing how to get rid of me. One must have decided just how, because he shoved my shoulder so hard that I slammed into the center console of the car in which I was sitting, completely knocked out of my trance. I could feel the place his hand had shoved me five minutes later, still aching as if I had actually been shoved. It was bizarre.
Anyway....
Yeah. I disagree about Monroe, and simply calling him a "bad man" doesn't really match up against his lifetime of good works.
That said, I guess in my response it's probably apparent that I'm more curious about your feedback concerning my experiences I shared here than arguing about the great Robert Monroe, but I am willing to do that too, if need be.
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u/danl999
2 points2022-06-11 17:35
I'm not going to read your rant, because it's obvious you've never seen enough real magic or you'd understand.
And maybe there's some tedious mental illness in there too.
We see it day in and day out in this subreddit, and no one can afford to analyze a random new person, to "be fair to him".
If we did, this place would implode.
Likely you're pretending your magic, don't care about others much and are willing to do careless harm, but perhaps have an occasional random intent gift that won't amount to much because you have no sobriety to make use of it.
But to explain it more simply, so maybe it will get through to you, Monroe stole the future potential of anyone he deceived.
And he did it for money and attention.
And at a time when the Castaneda community badly needed at least a few, to actually follow the instructions Carlos gave them.
Monroe was on the side saying, "Mine is easier". And deliberately targeting the Castaneda population.
I don't understand how you can see him as anything else but evil...
He was like a pimp, luring young women to a life of abuse.
Some pimps are very charming! But they're still pimps.
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u/TechnoMagical_Intent
1 points2022-06-11 19:15
But to explain it more simply, so maybe it will get through to you, Monroe stole the future potential of anyone he deceived.
And he did it for money and attention.
And at a time when the Castaneda community badly needed at least a few, to actually follow the instructions Carlos gave them.
Monroe was on the side saying, “Mine is easier”. And deliberately targeting the Castaneda population.
I don’t understand how you can see him as anything else but evil…
Future being the key word.
It’s not hard to be an esoteric drug dealer and get acolytes to the green line on the J-Curve.
But getting them hooked on your “drug,” to the point where they stop reaching for or even completely forget there’s anything beyond (just give it a couple thousand years, ^cough pick a socially-accepted religion)…yep, that’s evil.
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u/danl999
2 points2022-06-11 20:08
Monroe might indeed be responsible for all the horrible trouble Castaneda saw all these years.
Just trying to give us something more precious than anything man currently has, he was attacked endlessly.
It would only have taken a single person to take him seriously, learn to move his assemblage point, and everything could have changed.
But Monroe wanted to pretend to offer a make believe substitute.
How is that ok???
I think it's only "ok" to pretend magic followers.
The thinking must be, "Oh come on we all know magic is pretend. So why pick on Monroe?"
At least I hope that's the thinking.
Because the other alternative I can think of is worse.
Not actually being able to tell the difference between real magic, and pretend magic.
And then pretending to be "fair minded".
Like this poster.
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u/ForestMonstr
3 points2022-06-11 01:38
I don’t believe this path (silence, detachment, erasing personal history, etc) gives a lot back to a partner or a spouse.
Fwiw, I failed to simultaneously master both lifestyles so I had to pick the life I needed, not the life I wanted. It took me 2 marriages to learn that lesson.
19 Comments
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I’m from a similar background. Except I had no expectations before reading the first book.
Hopes. But no expectations.
And after, I very much realized I was hooked…but still did the survey/review thing for years.
I had the benefit of not having consistent/at home Internet access, so I didn’t do so much as a peek of the search term “Carlos Castaneda” until some months after reading the books on my own.
But things weren't really all that toxic, Castaneda-wise, on the Internet until around 2007 or so. Right around the time the iPhone came out 🧐.
The only teaching that's worked though human history as far as we know, is young children given to the old seers 8000 years ago. Like our guy who's merged with Carol Tiggs. He was given as a small child.
It's like Yoda says, "Too old to begin the training he is."
I firmly believe those are from the witch Soledad, from the books. She was working in Hollywood for years or decades, probably using the lineage's accumulated wealth of close to 800 years. Fabulous art works they had. All needed to go when the lineage ended.
You could teach sorcery to a child. Easily in fact!
But to an adult, is not possible.
No one can teach sorcery to an individual. If you stick around here, you'll see it's true.
The lineages were not the same as trying to teach an individual. They tricked them, using 15 other sorcerers.
With 15 real sorcerers and a trick to keep the apprentice around, you just slap their back into heightened awareness and teach that way. When they return to normal, they don't remember.
So all you have to do is keep them amused with stories and fun outdoor activities.
As for individuals, I tried for 20 years after Carlos died. Couldn't teach a single one. Some even wasted 10 years of my time.
Carlos also failed to teach even a single person, as far as I know. And if he did, shame on them for letting things get so bad that all the search results said Carlos was a fake.
BUT, you can take a group of 500, do your best to motivate them, and let the one who has the time, is actually interested in real magic, and has no family or social life holding them back, succeed.
We get 1 in 500 is my guess.
In the long run.
But just to move the assemblage point and see real magic for the first time in their lives, we might get 1 in 100.
And so we have around 50 now.
So what I'm telling you is, it's up to you. No one in here can teach you.
Work hard, and try to use the least amount of the more experienced people's time on things that don't help anyone.
Don't visit (much), don't speculate, don't bring in outside shit. If you stop working, then stop commenting. Don't "hang out". It's very harmful to others.
We have only this last chance to save magic.
And how long we can save it for, is questionable. We come under endless attack.
Like today.
This place will be wiped out if we aren't careful.
In your case, you need to force yourself silent and learn to move the assemblage point.
Nothing else is going to keep you going.
Don't find an excuse to "work on something else".
You need to see "the real thing", because it's so much work to learn to get silent.
And unfortunately, even seeing real magic isn't enough to keep people going because there's no "company" out there.
It's very cold, practicing the real thing.
No one can follow you into infinity.
Except Cholita...
I got lucky.
There may be a few other of the women who could do that.
But we aren't there yet.
Would you say one can’t become a sorcerer if he is married with kids?
Would you say such doubts could be a suitable intent to become a sorcerer?
We might want to "survey" anyone who makes it to silent knowledge on a reliable basis.
To find out what the commonality is.
How long did they actually work, as opposed to how long they said they worked.
And whether they stopped a while and returned after a break.
And how badly being all alone in that practice felt.
It's unique in that you can't share it at all. You'll get lynched.
You spend an hour in heaven chatting up God, and you can't tell anyone. They don't want to hear it.
They don't even care that you erected a giant freeway overpass in your bedroom, so you could stage insurance fraud.
I just don't get it...
It would also be interesting to see how often the people who make it to SK encountered inorganic beings.
I'm pretty much up to my ears in them. If I don't see one 20 times in a night, I'm feeling cheated.
I sent one to wake up a witch last night. It was like sending "Lassie" to save little Timmy from the mine shaft he got trapped in.
"Come here Lassie!!! Go wake up the witch. Yes, the witch. That'll be fun Lassie!"
And it did!
It even came back to make a lame excuse for a few seconds. Like Lassie returning to tell you the mine shaft has collapsed.
So you say, "Then dig Lassie, Dig!!!"
It actually wanted "permission" I suppose. The witch wasn't paying attention to him, so more drastic measures were required.
I wish I knew what as up with the permission thing.
Oh, and it was Minx.
I had to say that, or face him tonight.
Minx said I should stop dissing him in here.
Seeing as how he might decide to help us.
Did you send minx or ask minx to go?
Permission is a bit odd with IOBs. I've noticed that what they consider permission does not always equate to what a modern human considers "permission".
Thus, minx needed "your"? permission or a humans permission? to take it to the next level?
The witch gave me permission, so i looked for minx, and surprisingly, he showed up.
At first, he was just there to cause trouble, the way he does in Cholita's phantom house.
He was running around pretending to "help" me find the binoculars.
But he got hooked on the energy of the Tunnel. And Cholita made a couple of rare appearances, remote viewing me from elsewhere.
I suppose Minx also has Cholita's permission.
But Cholita will "extract payment" for my use of Minx.
So I've been distracting her with shrubbery for her garden.
She punishes me if she uses the shrubbery by tossing something I've been using out. Like the hose I got, so I didn't disturb her complicated arrangement of hoses.
Or the spray nosil I use, so she can't detect me watering plants when she's not there.
Cholita isn't careful about making sure her plants have enough water. She has "rules of watering", which apply to ordinary dirt in pots.
Not to high quality potting soil, which is best watered each day.
She tosses out garden related stuff of mine, so that her liking my plant choices doesn't go to my head.
Speaking of "permission", I was seeing if I could move all the way to silent knowledge just after waking up before it was time to go shower this morning, if I didn't turn the lights on.
And I succeeded!
An IOB, possibly Fancy, showed up to make me an offer.
I told her, "Sure, that sounds good. Let's do that."
Then I realized, in some demented IOB thought process that might be permission to kidnap me.
I had to add, "As long as it doesn't trap me anywhere."
You really do have to be careful it seems. I was in SK territory, so the worry was actually a tiny piece of silent knowledge.
Don't agree to gifts or visits anywhere, unless you think first if there might be "permission" hidden in there.
Don't pick up objects in their world either. I suppose that could be taken as stealing from them, and worthy of incarceration?
Picking up on your speculation about stealing might be what they are reacting to - it could be another reason the lineage encourages one to get rid of "concern," and that difficult to understand balance of abandon without being stupid+death-seeking. I wanna call it strategic abandon, or maybe someone else did and I've forgotten.
Obviously concern is eliminated during inner-silence, but what about the role of concern in the story of Carol and Carlos when they ended up in the IOB realm together, yet did not put on those clothes?
If they hadn't mastered the setting aside of concern for their physical bodies appropriately where it didn't make sense, like the IOB realm, then they probably put on the clothes purely automatically, out of habit and concern for their nakedness.
The IOBs are obliged to push us to enhance awareness just as we are obligated to push everything around us to enhance awareness, and tricks like that are, perhaps among other things, a test of how far the human has evolved, and if it's not far enough to dodge what should be an easy test (I say easy because concerns about the physical self are irrelevant in the IOB realm - the physical self isn't even there), then they keep the human but only until the human overcomes certain concerns about existing? Then, perhaps women never get trapped because of their more developed capacity to let go and why the death defier's trick really worked.
Just a thought!
The permission thing is weird. I've had it come up before but I don't really understand the nuances to it.
Perhaps it is something to do with intent. We are giving them our intent to do something and they can act on that? Or some kind of energetic resources. 'Like, yes, I could theoretically haunt that guy who stole your money, but I can't actually do it without permission - which is you directing me to who he is and where I can find him.'
Maybe it's just weird IOB etiquette..
My tunnel project partner and I have both concluded, maybe I now have a right to "give her to the IOBs".
So I need to be careful.
Wasn't it Rosario who gave Elias and Amalia to the IOBs by accident?
Except his "accident" was to gift wrap them in a box, and hand them over.
Not much of an "accident".
I suspect he just didn't really expect that to work.
Maybe he thought the IOBs would just visit them more, to help him teach.
But they couldn't resist snatching them completely.
New theory on that.
Humans cannot teleport their physical matter on their own.
they can "shrink it", and fully switch to the double.
But I don't myself believe, they can "wake up at the other end".
Without assistance to move the "shrunk Tonal".
Its' just a theory.
But it partly comes from "The Caretaker" of that transportation complex I visit nightly.
He implied it was no problem for the earth to move your physical matter along with your dream bubble (energy body).
Because it's a HUGE inorganic being.
And we know, IOBS can move stuff. I've seen it up close!
And don Juan said, the IOBs first kidnap the double.
Then later they send more of their friends to snatch the physical matter.
So the "theory" makes a little sense.
The earth is how sorcerers move both.
Just a theory...
You can do the all day silence thing, and sunlight outdoor gazing during lunch or breaks.
So no, you can definitely do it!
I'm not sure what the problem is. Why so few will make an effort.
100 come in here, only one actually puts in some work for long enough to get to the green zone reliably.
And we're not talking impossible amounts of work.
It's no more than if you played basketball with your buddies in the evening.
Or if you loved night time scuba diving.
Or if you decided to join a las Vegas lounge band, and had never played the trumpet before.
2 or 3 hours a day.
But crap magic things like Monroe train you to think you can just make up stuff about your dreams and get the attention, even if you never actually get any real magic.
And meditation systems tell you that you only need 20 minutes in the evening, and 20 minutes in the morning.
We've been trained that "magic isn't worth much." And of course, pretend magic isn't.
But there will eventually come a time when you can leave your darkroom like you were traveling into the mountains.
Then it becomes very alluring. At that point, time is NOT the issue. Practice substitutes for sleep way out there on the J curve.
The problem then is dreaming energy.
I don't know what happens if you have a family at that point.
But when you gain that much skill, the wife will absorb it. Might even learn to go along with you.
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He was an evil bastard?
But there's no way you are able to understand that. You're probably living in pretend magic land, with a side dish of "scientific reasoning".
I could use an analogy to help you understand.
Lets say there was a mountain where if you searched well, you could find your own gold mine.
It was known far and wide as "Gold Mountain!"
But oddly, it took too much searching and so far only a very few found their own gold mine.
Monroe came along and was interested, but far too lazy to do all that searching.
And yet, he noticed all the profit potential among fans of Gold Mountain.
So he sold fake maps, to pretend gold mines. And then set up a "gold certification" program, with "gold expert" degrees.
He not only cheated people by cashing in on the fans of Gold Mountain, but he thought up a way to silence people who pointed out their "gold" was just a pyrite.
He "certified it". And taught them to accept crappy pyrite to boot, explaining how they needed to "visualize" it.
That's how Buddhism works too. They lie and promise magic, and lie and say the Buddha's meditation powers were advanced.
When he was just a crappy beginner with some crummy scribes willing to exaggerate his accomplishments, and weave older writings into it to make it seem wise.
But it's also a huge system with amazing temples, "Dali Lamas", and all sorts of "certifications" you could earn, to get lots of attention from others. You even get to sit on a little throne, and go into business for yourself.
So devoted buddhists (of meditation) are "lost". They will never escape that self-absorbed prison.
Monroe created one of those too, so he could cash in on Carlos.
And anyone who follows his path too far, will NEVER learn sorcery.
Which is utterly amazing. We have real magic, in your face, for hours a day if you can find the time. Magic so astounding, monroe fans won't even believe or comprehend it.
They "gloss". If you describe what we do, they remember a nightmare they had 5 years ago, and try to equate it to what we do day in and day out, for hours each time.
Someone has to remind them, "Uh... We do all this with our eyes open. And not once every thousand years."
They don't even have honesty going for them.
Monroe teaches them to make up stuff to get attention. And then "certifies" it.
Last night I was wandering around 100,000 year old ruins left by proto-humans who practiced sorcery.
For real!
And let me remind you, in case you are a Monroe fan, I was fully awake with my eyes open. Not making up stuff about bad dreams disturbed by Monroes "techniques".
In fact, I walked past the walls of my bedroom. Not laying in bed pretending. I literally walked in my physical body, outside the limits of the room.
A strange woman came to help me learn something about them, possibly after traveling 6000 miles to a witch I work with, to borrow some of her dark energy.
It might have been a "Golem" being.
Bottom line: Monroe was a very bad man, and whoever took over for him is also.
Just one of hundreds "riding on the back of Carlos Castaneda", to steal from others.
But how did you end up in here?
I can't keep track of user ids.
We had an attack by Monroe zombies this week.
Was it from my comments on Youtube?
I'll keep doing that, until Monroe Institute is known to be harmful to people.
It's long overdue.
I saw your rant about Monroe on the astralprojection subreddit. Not sure why you'd assume I'm some closed-minded follower for asking a simple question.
I ask because I don't understand the hate. I read his first book and listened to his tapes and got into the astral in around two weeks. More on that later.
I am a little intrigued by Carlos Castaneda, but mostly for... ironic reasons. Let's just say that even just looking at his first book's cover makes the world feel very dreamlike. You see, I have Yaqui blood, as well as Wintu. I know for sure my Wintu heritage is through at least two successive healers, shamans - whatever you want to call them. My Yaqui background is more mysterious because my great grandfather abandoned his Wintu wife and their son when my grandfather was a baby, so my grandfather was raised only by his Wintu family.
But that's not the interesting part.
Both my mother and I... I guess inherited non-physical Indian friends. Hers were her "witch friends" and mine had specific names that I don't feel like sharing right now.
Mine hung around with me when I was three. I have several clear memories of them and a whole lot of not so clear ones.
They didn't say much. One didn't talk at all. The one that didn't talk was neither male or female and had waist-length hair that covered its back, and its face. I only saw its face once after a long time of pestering it about it, and it was unpleasant to say the least.
Anyway, they would sometimes take me to "visit family." There was a wooden well house like a shed outside our house and they would guide me to the wall where we'd walk through it and appear inside a small white house in the middle of the desert where four or more Indians lived. This happened multiple times. The Indians knew who I was but I had no idea who they were. Looking back, I think they were dead.
There's more to all this but this is all I feel like sharing.
Let's just say that I have a past that supports your belief in real magic. It is indeed real. I have even been able to remote view into my past and look at these beings from any angle I want. They're as real as anyone, but made of light rather than physical matter, if that makes sense.
In more recent times - a month ago - while trying to astral project in a car, just beyond the hypnagogic, my mind completely silent, I did something that I don't think was necessarily astral projecting, but I'm not sure what it was (maybe you have an explanation). My mind was 100% void of chatter, and I was floating in a void as colorful as the colors in a soap bubble. In it were two beings that were the same colors as their surroundings, lots of greens, purples, pinks, and they were discussing their annoyance at my sudden intrusion. I was all but unconscious, although I was listening. One asked the other if he knew me, and when they realized neither did, they started discussing how to get rid of me. One must have decided just how, because he shoved my shoulder so hard that I slammed into the center console of the car in which I was sitting, completely knocked out of my trance. I could feel the place his hand had shoved me five minutes later, still aching as if I had actually been shoved. It was bizarre.
Anyway....
Yeah. I disagree about Monroe, and simply calling him a "bad man" doesn't really match up against his lifetime of good works.
That said, I guess in my response it's probably apparent that I'm more curious about your feedback concerning my experiences I shared here than arguing about the great Robert Monroe, but I am willing to do that too, if need be.
I'm not going to read your rant, because it's obvious you've never seen enough real magic or you'd understand.
And maybe there's some tedious mental illness in there too.
We see it day in and day out in this subreddit, and no one can afford to analyze a random new person, to "be fair to him".
If we did, this place would implode.
Likely you're pretending your magic, don't care about others much and are willing to do careless harm, but perhaps have an occasional random intent gift that won't amount to much because you have no sobriety to make use of it.
But to explain it more simply, so maybe it will get through to you, Monroe stole the future potential of anyone he deceived.
And he did it for money and attention.
And at a time when the Castaneda community badly needed at least a few, to actually follow the instructions Carlos gave them.
Monroe was on the side saying, "Mine is easier". And deliberately targeting the Castaneda population.
I don't understand how you can see him as anything else but evil...
He was like a pimp, luring young women to a life of abuse.
Some pimps are very charming! But they're still pimps.
Future being the key word.
It’s not hard to be an esoteric drug dealer and get acolytes to the green line on the J-Curve.
But getting them hooked on your “drug,” to the point where they stop reaching for or even completely forget there’s anything beyond (just give it a couple thousand years, ^cough pick a socially-accepted religion)…yep, that’s evil.
Monroe might indeed be responsible for all the horrible trouble Castaneda saw all these years.
Just trying to give us something more precious than anything man currently has, he was attacked endlessly.
It would only have taken a single person to take him seriously, learn to move his assemblage point, and everything could have changed.
But Monroe wanted to pretend to offer a make believe substitute.
How is that ok???
I think it's only "ok" to pretend magic followers.
The thinking must be, "Oh come on we all know magic is pretend. So why pick on Monroe?"
At least I hope that's the thinking.
Because the other alternative I can think of is worse.
Not actually being able to tell the difference between real magic, and pretend magic.
And then pretending to be "fair minded".
Like this poster.
I don’t believe this path (silence, detachment, erasing personal history, etc) gives a lot back to a partner or a spouse.
Fwiw, I failed to simultaneously master both lifestyles so I had to pick the life I needed, not the life I wanted. It took me 2 marriages to learn that lesson.