Hi everyone, I’ve been meaning to start reading Carlos Castaneda’s works but I’m a bit unsure about the order that makes the most sense.
For those of you who are familiar with his books, which one would you recommend beginning with, and how should I continue from there?
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I usually recommend skipping the first book, The Teachings of Don Juan, because it is essentially the mass market printing of his Ph.D. dissertation.
Reading the books in chronological order, starting with A Separate Reality, takes you along Castaneda's development cycle and builds on what he learns over the years.
In fact, it could be much more challenging to follow the later books if you didn't read the earlier ones.
And doing so builds discipline anyway.
Yes , I wholeheartedly agree. I started reading the books when I was 14 am now 65, but I started with Journey to Ixtlan , then went back to Separate Reality and from there to Tales of Power ( which is my absolute favorite). It’s weird because when I was a senior in Highschool The Second Ring of Power came out . I bought a brand new hardcover and gave it to a friend who happened to be in the hospital with food poisoning. Anyway from Tales onward I read in the order of their release .
I believe his PhD dissertation is actually The Road to Ixtlan
Has Anyone Ever Read Castaneda's Ph.D. Dissertation?
Journey To Ixtlan never read as being academic to me, which is why I often forget.
Maybe it's just that Carlos got better at writing after the first book, or that I was personally never as interested in the relation of power plants concoctions and other cultural minutia of Yaqui Shamanism as I was actual sorcery practice.
interesting thread
Keep in mind, the first 3 books are don Juan "hooking" Carlos by agreeing to be his PhD thesis "genuine shaman informant on the uses of hallucinogenic plants".
back in the early 60s, that was the "holy grail" of native american research.
In fact, it was largely the books of Carlos that started the hippy movement idea that they could use drugs, to bypass years of Yogi meditation.
So after the hippies made pests of themselves, the social order turned on drug usage.
In context, it was perfectly ok to study how the Indians used Devil's Weed, and magic mushrooms.
Carlos started looking for his "informant" at Morongo reservation, where my father was also studying the same topic. So Morongo's shamans told Carlos they could be his informant, since he was UCLA, and they were already being studied by UCR.
But don Juan didn't teach him about the Yaqui as he presumed. Don Juan was a Yaqui from near Fort Ortiz in Mexico, with ancestry back to Arizona, but no actual affiliation to "Yaqui shamanism".
In fact, Yaqui shamanism is non-functional. Doesn't produce the kind of magic you read about in the books.
thus, don't take what you read in those first 3 too literally.
Behind the scenes, Carlos was being taught the real thing in "heightened awareness", which is what dark room brings you to.
And like our own problem there, Carlos couldn't remember an of that teaching.
It doesn't come out until "The Second Ring of Power", perhaps book #5.
That's where this subreddit starts its focus, just as Carlos advised us us to do before he died.
The early books end up creating a lot of confused, angry men who never manage to make any of this magic work. They only pick up the "boyscout rules" of the "Men of Knowledge".
Who are not anything at all you'd want to be. Nor could you, since their Allies and rituals are long lost.
However, the first book has Carlos "finding his spot".
That's pretty much what our "darkroom practice" does, except we stop focusing on power spots, and focus on the colors he saw.
Welcome to REAL magic.
It'll blow your mind, and no one will believe you.
That's the way real magic always is. No one believes it.
Be sure to keep this map in mind. Carlos gave it to us before he died.
The series have many contradictory statements. Even Don Juan himself stated opposing facts on numerous occasions. This indeed, can be overwhelming for a beginner. However, what is it in book #4 that you don’t find useful or helpful? I think that the “real thing” starts just right there.
It's been 40 years since I read that, and Carlos told me to stop reading his books.
So, I really can't answer that.
But the whole concept of "Power" is a big mistake.
One Reni is using to provide fake magic to her paid "certified" teachers.
Explaining "How to tell when you are in it" (power).
So you can see the possible abuses reading "Tales of Power".
It's a very bad point of view for those who have to learn.
Perhaps a useful point of view, if you have an entire lineage doing magic for you.
In fact, having Cholita around, the idea of her having "Power" makes a lot of sense, when she breaks the laws of physics right in front of me.
But for a person trying to learn, pretending you are living a "good life" as an impeccable warrior, so that you will also gain "power" is a totally delusional point of view.
You EARN magic. One tiny step at a time.
That is, when you don't have a lineage around zapping you right and left.
Honestly, I think that you simply didn’t word your thoughts well, because I firmly believe that there IS A SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE between a person that indulges in life’s vices like Lucio and an impeccable warrior like Don Juan. Furthermore, let’s cite Juan’s advice towards unnecessarily obese people, or just people in bad physical shape generally speaking.
“Her bones are not as bad, she is not as old to be acting this way. There really aren’t any reasons to treat your body like that”. This also reminds me of La Gorda and her quest to loose weight. It is said that in order for one to be a sorcerer, one must develop iron-like discipline (among many other things). It seems that the whole point is quite opposite of the “do as thou will” philosophy!
But don Juan's behavior comes automatically from getting good at sorcery.
My own behavior keeps modifying towards that "impeccable" status.
That has nothing to do with that being a good "cause" for learning sorcery.
It's an effect, not a cause.
Karlos is dead. So why are you still not reading the books ?
I've only ever come across one person who cannot read books anymore. He was extremely telepathic, relatively unknown. He said he doesn't read books because he shine like a lamp across history and that can be taken advantage of by entities unknown to him. I have my own reasons to not read though
Because he told me not to read his books anymore.
And can't "untell" me now, unless he wants to visit again.
I'm also still celibate after 30+ years.
If Carlos asked me to do something, I did it.
That way he "owed" me.
And he always paid his debts!
Often with a "blank check" if the debt was moderately large.
And I read a lot of books. Mostly technical these days.
Just not his.
And not books by fake magical systems, because there's nothing in those other than delusions that infect the minds of followers.
Sorcery works that way. It's outside this reality, and any delusions you bring along will manifest one way or the other.
Witness the "evil clown effect", which we've tested in here a few times.
You'll learn about that, if you manage to get your own Ally.
Not that everyone doesn't already have one, messing with them as a "scout" in their dreams.
But perceiving them in this realm, takes a deliberate movement of the assemblage point, to below the shoulder blades.
" any delusion you bring will manifest....."
https://preview.redd.it/zafs0jtriqqf1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4c7bdf2dcafcedad110203c59a64e4aae7876ed4
All of them might.
But you're thinking about this in a mechanical way. So the drugs haven't done you any good afterall.
Except that you might know the answer to this one: Would you hallucinate any of those, if you thought about them while on an LSD trip?
Obviously you would.
>Do you think karlos ever wrote you into his books but with a different name ? If he did, do you think he'd want you to find out ?
That's either borderline schizophrenia talking, or an attempt to turn real magic, into a pretend magical system where the leader is all powerful.
You'll need more sobriety if you hope to learn sorcery. So that you don't mistake one thing, for another.
>Anyway at what stage does the manifestations you spoke about starts ?
Obviously in the green station, or else Buddhists and Yogis wouldn't be so delusional.
They'd merely be liars.
But they actually believe they've "verified" stuff that's completely wrong.
Such as reincarnation.
And their fake explanations of reality and consciousness, are easily "verified" by their followers.
That's why fake magical systems are so harmful to mankind. The green zone produces easy verification of your delusions.
You get "slimed".
A good rule of thumb: If you don't pee your pants, it's beginner's magic and you need to get past it as soon as you can.
If you feel "bliss", you're right in the middle of the thickest slime in the river of shit where mankind currently resides.
Nah. I don't do dr#gs. Don't drink. Don't smoke either. I don't know how to drag the smoke into my lungs. I was surprised to find that people write off their substance induced experience as something spiritual. I'm not against it though. Might try acid or something in the future if i manage to convince my guy friends to get it for me lmao
I'm very much trying to learn sorcery.
I mean all religious books are strewn with a people, individuals or whole nations being written about without the written about person pov. That said it's not that difficult to find eglishphere scholars writing about other people, nations and even individuals without their consent even in modern day so I'm just asking :)
What does "we two become one" mean from your understanding ?
In sorcery, the awareness of one person can use another person for its container.
So it's not abnormal in sorcery, for a tree or a dog to actually be one of the old sorcerers from Olmec times, who found a way out of the inorganic being's realm. Or turned themselves into something else.
Carol Tiggs said as you progress in sorcery, you get offered "upgrades".
But that means, you take in the awareness of some other being.
Doesn't mean you get taken over.
You just have more energy now.
And off in the deep second attention, you don't really have a "personality" the way you think of that, in normal life.
You're already "someone else", and happy to be that person instead of the wretches we were all raised to be.
I believe there were 4 beings in don Juan's group, who weren't really people in the normal sense.
We're only people because we got stuck in this organic container.
And if you move your assemblage point to the other side of your body, you can find places where you are someone else.
Not even human most of the time.
It's an alternate version of this planet, running simultaneously.
And you can decide to live there instead.
Don't ask me what happens to your current version.
No one told us.
So just to be safe, we only "visit" and only for short durations.
You can't perceive those realities as they look to the locals, unless you stay there a long time.
For instance, the "people" there might have 4 arms.
But you wouldn't notice that at first.
None of this is theory, so be sure you get to work, so that you come to realize it's all true.
Otherwise it won't benefit you to have your questions answered.
Might even be harmful, since once you really understand, cozy "religions" no longer seem like something you ought to be participating in, since they're 100% lies.
Some are good however, if you don't have any "code of behavior" you follow.
Some...
Some are the opposite of good, and teach people to cut other's heads off in the name of prophets who never actually lived.
How long do sorcerers stay like that ? If let's say, a cedar tree is a sorcerer in hibernation. And if other currecntly human sorcerers wrote "the cedars trees were cut down to make the new temple". Can it be possible that the cedar sorcerers were forced to birth into humans ?
Also the other day i listened to an audio of karlos books, he said inorganic beings are stationary. I wasn't expecting that. Fascinating stuff.
Well seeing as you put so much effort, I'm sure you won't fail to achieve whatever you're trying to achieve.
5000 years is the oldest tree I know of.
I's not far from my home.
So it's an attempt to live on for a few thousand years, which sorcerers consider not really worth the effort.
We have the "tensegrity pass" to do that.
Stellar Hatch.
Saw the video.
So i still don't fully understand your explanation of "we two become one" . I doubt it has anything to do with trees. Religion explains two becoming one in the sense of marriage ie s#x. We are reading the same thing but interpreting it in a completely different way.
An inorganic being told karlos that when you have s#x, you've become a part of that specific family because you now share energy therefore have access to that souls family energy group which would otherwise be not available to you.
So s#x can be a very powerful tool of dominion for men but not for women though.
I always knew in the other realms that talking to each other, meeting or even just reading their books would be interpreted as similar to s#x ie you have access to their energy.
So when Zenophone met sokrates, kabriel met mohmd, met jesus mother, when hesiod implored people to listen and not rebel against xeus because "he's an eagle and we are mere nightingales", when zakob wrestled with a man all night long. All these events are a merging of energy, they are s#xual in nature. It is embellished and sanitized in a language acceptable to be read by kids and the larger public.
I've merged with people I've never met and so I googled and an anime kimi no nawa seems to have been about merging with people. So I watched the show. I thought a love story thingy would happen to me as well. Nope didn't happen lol . The merging / possession is very clinical. There can never be one sided merging it's always a two way street. The idea of something foreign merging with you doesn't sit well with me as I'm a bit of a clean freak.
Karlos wrote from the perspective of a human who did not spend a thousand years as a tree. It would be very interesting to hear the life experience of a reversee ie a tree who is now a human. In fact I've never come across such literatures.
It just dawned on me that we have been reading "family tree" as a metaphor even in religion and everyday langauge and that is wrong. It is literal. Every single ethnicity has a physical tree counterpart that they're connected with because it's the trees that their ancestors choose to turn into. Trees are the stationary inorganic beings spoken about by karlos. The purest and most beneficient ones are found in the Himalayas.
The tree of knowlege and tree of life are all literal trees and they too have a human counterpart, a specific ethnicity. And these trees energies can be accessed by having s#x with their counterpart human ethnicities even if you don't belong to the same ethnicity. No such thing as having s#x with the bark of a literal tree.
This is why I said men are born with dominating tools. They have a d#ck ! They can do so much only if they know how to use it for things other than mindless carnal cardio.
Karlos did say the sorcerers wanted to be inorganic beings.
So when the l@#d rested on the seventh day, the specific ethnicity that claims to carry his name turns into a tree apparently. These people wanna be trees!
No wonder that old tampon loving, britsh family and their scandanavian cohorts are yapping about trees and environment and what not which they call wwf or something.
Who would've thunk a reddit discussion would yield entirely new knowlege eh ?
>An inorganic being told karlos that when you have s#x, you've become a part of that specific family because you now share energy therefore have access to that souls family energy group which would otherwise be not available to you.
Where did you read that?
As far as I know, Carlos never said anything like that.
And we have the collected notes of all lectures and workshops, and all the books in a single searchable pdf.
What word should I search on to see if he said that?
I haven't read the books. I listen to audios.
20.25
The emissary said you two have "met" before. Again it said you two have "wrestled" and that results them in being akin to relatives and then he compared it to blood relative. You cannot just become relatives of people that you only shake hands with.
The emissary uses two words that means s#x in ancient writing terms ie met and wrestled. You can interpret that to mean karlos had s#x with a human counterpart of those species of trees before he gained access to their realms.
They're not gonna write "aprahm had s#x with an angel and he discolated his thigh ( meaning his d!ck )"
The guy allegedly met an inorganic being and biblical writers call it an angel of the l@#d. I might change my mind in the future given new infos but that's how I understand for now.
I don't think Karlos was all that far removed from biblical tradition. He uses double / overlapping terms those writers used all the time.
Before I ever know who he or this sub was, I've always known words like meeting, wrestled, going to the cave, grottos even sometimes temples are words used by ancient writers as an euphemism for s#x and it's surrounding area.
Those words carry the same meaning as the word "knowing" in the bible.
I'm aware my interpretation are often unique and is alien to most people.
Boy oh boy, I wonder what Carlos was doing with those sticks given your interpretation.
"I stared at them openmouthed; they were not as tall as in my dreams. They had shrunk to half their size. Instead of being shapes of opaque luminosity, they were now two condensed, dark, almost black, menacing sticks.
"Get up and grab one of them," don Juan ordered me, "and don't let go, no matter how it shakes you."
I definitely did not want to do anything of the sort, but some unknown drive made me stand up against my will. I had at that moment the clear realization that I would end up doing what he had ordered me to, although I had no conscious intention of doing so.
Mechanically, I advanced toward the two figures, my heart pounding nearly out of my chest. I grabbed the one to my right. What I felt was an electric discharge that almost made me drop the dark figure.
Don Juan's voice came to me as if he had been yelling from a distance away. "You drop it and you're done for," he said.
I held on to the figure, which twirled and shook. Not like a massive animal would, but like something quite fluffy and light, although strongly electrical. We rolled and turned on the sand of the gully for quite some time. It gave me jolt after jolt of some sickening electric current. I thought it was sickening because I fancied it to be different from the energy I had always encountered in our daily world. When it hit my body, it tickled me and made me yell and growl like an animal, not in anguish but in a strange anger"
That's a serious horizontal shift. And not an actual view of a deeper perception of reality.
We can do that.
It's just playing with stuff in the deep red zone. But playing naturally, because it's interesting and enjoyable, and it might require an Ally to be around, to shift far enough for something like that to happen.
The sticks are two allies, and Carlos had to wrestle with them. Or, apparently, Carlos had sex with them.
How did he get to perceive them?
Wandering in the desert with don Juan?
Of course! Don Juan is right beside him in the text I sent
Don seemed to be right beside him when he teleported to the coin stands. Certainly they were talking back and forth.
You can't really be sure when don Juan is said to be "right next to him", especially since it might ultimately turn out that don Juan was usually his own double, the way Genaro was.
I wonder if don Juan's double could give "The Nagual's blow"???
Maybe not.
Maybe, he had to start Carlos out in person, and then could switch to his double, to avoid hiking around the mountain desert, in his 70 year old body.
Looks like our OP has deleted the post.
Didn't get the attention he wanted.
Of course it could be Don Juan’s double, but he said that Carlos wrestled/had sex with with the IOB. What he is referring to is the section I posted
The OP deleted it, so I can't go back and read that again. I don't recall sex being mentioned!
It doesn't seem to say what you claimed at all, but I don't feel like listening to it more to make it fit your understanding.
As for the Bible, Carlos made fun of it constantly, and even advised us to "really study it!" at one point.
Claiming we'd see what nonsense it was.
So I did. I always obeyed Carlos.
At one point I had a better understanding of the bible than any priest, minister, or commentator I knew of, with the exception of just 2.
I didn't see that it was nonsense at all, and thought it was a pretty nice magical system, with the flaw that it's not true. All you have to do is watch some YouTube specials on Neanderthals and Denisovans, to fully refute the bible.
But as a magical system, it's rather nice. And certainly in its modern form, it's not harmful to those who practice it. Now that they gave up the killing of witches for the most part.
Not harmful to them, if you ignore that they'll die and that'll be the end of them.
It doesn't lead to living past death.
So if Carlos was pitching the bible in a new form, I would have noticed it. Having been in private classes for years, listening to a long lecture each class.
You're making up stuff.
However, if you get to work you'll realize it on your own, and then you won't be fooled by fake magic anymore.
Just try to cut back on contaminating beginners in here?
We only have a 1 in 100 success rate with getting people to actually follow instructions, and long term only 1 in 1000 will stick with it once they understand what "real magic" actually is.
I typed out an entire paragraph and it just disappeared 😔
Anyway I'll try and practice my j curve for a good six months. If nothing happens I'll say f#ck it, not for me.
I'll see myself out before I create more chaos lmao
Wait I miss this part. What do you mean time seems to pass in a wrong way for them ? After they gobble up stars energy what do they turn into ? Blackhole ??
How long do they live ?
Why wouldn't anyone wanna try that out it seems perfect !! 🤔
We don't know much more about it.
It's only taught to apprentices because the lineages tended to accumulate "death defiers".
Sorcerers who refused to die, and took extreme steps to go on living.
I suppose eventually they regret the choice, and our lineage had a tendency to try to save them from their own doings.
Didn't you watch that "Third Attention" video where it shows the ways the old seers lived past death?
I left out the dog Manfred, but the sorceress had a pet dog which joined her, so it's in there, kind of.
Those are the choices we know about.
Oh I did but only till the stone part. I'll watch fully now. I thought those stones were the olmec heads. The turning into tree part I came to realise with a sort of "epiphany" not from your videos. Fascinating stuff anyway. These are all new infos to me. Suddenly historical writings makes more sense. I always thought when Greek myths wrote that someone was turning into a star, it was an over the top metaphor. Not a literal metamorphosis of humans into stars.
You're not implying that a death defier is active in this sub are you ? 🤔
No way to be sure about that.
This place is the only real magic going on, on the internet.
An old seer trying to live on, who had access to computers, would have found us.
Don Juan's lineage had 4 if you count the ones Carlos ended up with.
Two trees, one dog, one old seer body snatcher, and one blue scout.
I might have forgotten one or two more.
This is the first instance where I heard that there is an another reality running simultaneously which can be accessed by moving your AP. Actually, I remember bob monroe saying something along the lines, but I amnit sure whether you disregard him as charlatan. Could you tell me more about that #2 earth? I know, it isn’t contributing to my wizardry, but do me a favor.
You'd have to ask others for that info.
I haven't read the books in 30 years.
But someone else would know where those "600 worlds" are mentioned.
It's a real shame you can't spot charlatans on your own...
Or that you believe there's anything else out there at all, without any reasonable evidence for it.
I suppose because I got to hear Carlos' stories of his search for magic everywhere, with nothing found, I started to realize that myself when he died and I wanted answers from others.
But not only couldn't find any, I got the door slammed in my face for asking questions other magical systems are clueless about.
It's the hostile reaction that tells the full story.
No one with real magic, gets upset on hearing there might be better real magic!
It's the pretenders who get angry.
Ah, Dan. I have already debated with you about this particular topic. Even though I mentioned numerous indigenous people where real magic is present, you still have trouble accepting that. If DJ and company could jump 20m in the air, that doesn’t mean that a meager vertical movement of 20cm from an african shaman is negligible. It exists, it is real, but highly ineffective in comparison.
Point to just one.
Don't tell me, point to it so we can see what you're talking about.
It's vagueness and glossing that makes fake magical systems seem potentially real.
I've never seen any african shaman who wasn't an obvious fraud.
They were all like Indian Fakers, doing tricks for donations.
Listen, if you are to look at it that way, then CC’s legacy falls into that unproven category as well. I haven’t seen anyone first hand and the whole thing might be a fairy tale just like some people proclaim. Not only that, they wrote whole books on the topic. If the only evidence you accept is first hand experience, then we are left with very few options: my personal journey and experience from my closest friends, who don’t have any incentive to lie to me about such delicate truths and questions. So I won’t be naming the world famous examples: kahuna, reiki surgeons, aborigines, meso-american(even though many of those are documented on camera). Yes, many of these people use rituals, but some of them are effective to a certain extent. Let’s stick to my own research. As I live in the balkan region, magic was always a thing. However, older people were the ones who talked about witches and unusual things. There is a study published in UK that found that the number of reported cases of mysterious creatures and phenomena is tremendously decreasing. As we got hooked on technology and thoroughly “educated” by the system, it seems that the modern man has lost connection to other worlds. Belief plays a crucial role as well. Some people firmly believe stories like CC opus are simply fiction or psychosis. I have heard about extremely peculiar phenomena, some of it almost surpassed CC and those things were shared by a person who is an absolute skeptic. If it wasn’t a first hand experience, he wouldn’t believe it in a million years. Apart from that, I have personally used visualization to heal myself. It worked, much more efficiently than medication. Actually, medication didn’t help, that is why I resorted to some other methods. The system that did the trick is actually heavily influenced by kaballah and tree of life. It all boils down to visualization, breathing and celibate (this one is truly important). There are also some other events that I managed to pull off (create?), which weren’t likely to happen ever, but they did, just as I needed them to. It did seem as if I managed to wish/intend the circumstances I sought for. By the way, I was obsessed with impeccable behavior way before I even read the teachings. I know that your stance is that one is not to bother about that and that it comes as a result of doing magic, but I can assure you that just this simple rule of keeping your actions in alignment with your decisions and judgements makes an enormous difference in your life. You don’t even have to know about the intent and that you maintain a good tonal this way, it just works wonders. That is magic in itself. Once you thread firmly on that path, the universe starts to rearrange in your favor!
This kind of response deserves no further discussion.
So you're a magic groupie.
I wish you'd go hang out elsewhere, where you can't actually do any harm.
Even your user ID is harmful in here.
Does my username cause emotional damage to you dan?
Here we go! From ChatGPT:
***
Question:
Did anyone ever analyze all the various motivations for people believing in religion and pretend magical systems? There must be a list somewhere.
ChatGPT said:
Yes — this has been studied from a lot of angles: anthropology, psychology, sociology, and cognitive science. Scholars have made lists of why humans so often develop and cling to religion or magical systems.
Here’s a synthesized “motivation map” from the research:
🔹 Psychological motivations
🔹 Social motivations
✅ So yes — people have analyzed this to death. Religion and magical thinking persist because they scratch so many deep human itches: fear, control, belonging, meaning, morality, survival.
***
None of that has anything to do with this subreddit.
It's here to teach a specific technology.
Once you've been in here as long as you have, and still don't realize that, you don't really belong in here.
It's not fair to others who actually want to learn.
And there's plenty of pretend Castaneda discussion groups to inhabit.
Why here if you think it's not true???
And if you DO think it's true, why won't you learn it?
Where did you come up with presumption that I don’t want to learn/ that I didn’t learn already? As said, I even started with some of the practices long before reading CC’s work. Lucid dreaming was one of the things that captivated me. Funny enough, stephen laberge advised the same hand technique as don. On the other hand, I also maintained a good tonal without knowing what tonal is. It could even be said that I managed to “read/see” some abstract cores and act accordingly, also before getting acquainted with the material. Apart from darkroom, there really aren’t many techniques that one can do on a regular basis. I don’t about you guys, but it gets pretty hard when you need to balance your life between work/kids/freedom.
At this point, it is just excuses. I know one regular poster who does balance between work/kids/freedom. I also know that Dan works 12 hours per day. I also ended up on the Dean's list in accounting, purely due to sorcery practice, where before sorcery I had a problem with getting drunk and going out and getting punched in the head.
"Inventory Experts believe that explanations are the essence of learning."
"All intent works, but the wrong intent will be such a fractured (phantom room), you won't even be able to perceive it.
And mixing outside stuff is like mixing different jigsaw puzzles into a giant pile on the floor; really stupid, if you have any actual interest in putting together the puzzle.
Can't be undone, you just have to bulldoze the entire pile away and start over. Unfortunately, we're all bad players, and won't let go of the pieces we value. It's like finding a piece of the Buddha's ear on a jig saw puzzle. You're so excited, you run around showing your friends, you know what this pieces is! It's the Buddha's ear.
And you keep that in your pocket refusing to throw it out. When it's time to assemble a real jigsaw puzzle, like the Olmec scene, you keep trying to stuff the Buddhas ear into it.
That's all of us...
In fact, you can't clearly see phantom rooms or create them at will, because of all the pieces you have stuffed into your pockets, and refuse to let go. Silence lets you sneak out from the pieces you stuffed everywhere in your pockets (you have many), but only for a while."
https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/wiki/inventories/
I would suggest to just let go of your supposed pieces. It is not learning.
Please take a break for the time being.
"Stephen LaBerge (born 1947) is an American psychophysiologist specializing in the scientific study of lucid dreaming. In 1967 he received his bachelor's degree in mathematics. He began researching lucid dreaming for his Ph.D. in psychophysiology at Stanford University, which he received in 1980.[1] He developed techniques to enable himself and other researchers to enter a lucid dream state at will, most notably the MILD technique (mnemonic induction of lucid dreams), which was used in many forms of dream experimentation.[2] In 1987, he founded The Lucidity Institute, an organization that promotes research into lucid dreaming, as well as running courses for the general public on how to achieve a lucid dream.[3]
In the early 1980s, news of LaBerge's research using the technique of signaling to a collaborator monitoring his EEG with agreed-upon eye movements during REM helped to popularize lucid dreaming in the American media.
Wired magazine referred to him as the "Thomas Edison of lucid dreaming." source
"Carlos César Salvador Arana (December 25, 1925 – April 27, 1998), better known as Carlos Castaneda, was an American anthropologist and writer. Starting in 1968, Castaneda published a series of books that describe a training in shamanism that he (had already) received under the tutelage of a Yaqui "Man of Knowledge" named don Juan Matus."
Of course LaBerge literally just took it from Castaneda. It isn’t very funny when it’s just a sneak doing sneaky things and not crediting what he owes it to.
I let the search run a long time. Nothing in the books, but here's from lecture notes:
***
The theory of witches is that in the luminous egg of the human being there is a point that allows us to perceive and their art is to move that point so that they see that the perception of the world is not final since the point moves another point The assemblage point prevails. "How does the assemblage point move?" To get to freedom one has to stop routines, such as idealizing things. There are billions of possibilities to change the assemblage point, Don Juan thought that there were 600 worlds identical to this one in their reality but with different configuration and when one enters this type of knowledge they shake us but very healthily because it makes us little if we are not so full of ourselves that we do not get anywhere. How stupid! We are in a prison planet and if we get out we have to be fugitives, one leaves the cell with nothing, you can't say: -it's that in my cell there was a little doll so cute that I can't leave-.
***
The discovery of the assemblage point is what made the ancient sorcerers powerful. But for generations they went bananas figuring where to place it and how to fix it there. Thus emerged the arts of dreaming and stalking. Dreaming is the art of using the natural process of sleep to displace the assemblage point to new locations, and stalking is the art of affixing the assemblage point in the new position in order to assemble bona fide, new, all inclusive worlds. They became so versed in fixing the position of the assemblage point that they ended up in the new positions, staying there, never coming back. It's like skins of an onion. There are billions of possible positions, but not all of these give us all inclusive worlds. Don Juan figured that about 600 of the positions were worlds, the rest were phantoms, they were "too fast", and didn't have enough "meat" for us to hold on to. Not that don Juan ever got to them, but the sorcerers of antiquity did.
***
El punto de encaje es el mismo para toda la humanidad! El punto de encaje se encuentra a la altura de nuestro homoplato izquierdo, y a un brazo de distancia directamente hacia atras. El punto de encaje al moverse percive otros mundos. Hay muchos mundos inclusivos, los brujos antiguos contaron 600 posiciones
***
The assemblage point is found at the height of our left shoulder blade [?], at an arm's length straight back. When the assemblage point moves, other worlds are perceived. There are many complete worlds, the ancient sorcerers counted 600 positions
***
Carol Tiggs in one of the other seminars spoke of another world (one of the 600); getting to that world is something of which the flyers deprive us! But if we just have awareness between our big toes, that's why we talk only about "I." The more egomaniacal we are, the more food for the flyers!
***
(there's more but that's enough to g4et the idea).
For the "running at the same time, you'd have to search for another phrase, and I believe it was Taisha who said they weren't "past lives", but rather alternate timelines running concurrently.
Meaning, a different stream from the dark sea.
None of this is surprising once you can view those streams yourself, when you practice.
It only seems strange, when you believe this one is real and not also just a stream.
Each stream has it's own stream of physical matter, and the physical matter stream from one, is not the same as the physical matter stream of the other.
HOWEVER, we've tied up so much awareness in this reality, that we can't freely move back and forth.
Maybe the blue scout could...
Still, who cares?
You do get to see the other ones if you make an actual effort to learn.
It is just this word that struck me: they run concurrently/simultaneously. Therefore, I wonder if our essence changes worlds and what is left of us in this world when we enter another world even for a brief period. Monroe said that he inhibited (possessed?) someone’s body and that the guy had a wife and family. His “new wife” figured something was off and started to feel worried and kept asking him questions. That world was also quite similar to our as the guy, whose body container he was using, worked as an engineer in a company. Also, what happens to our double when we change our AP?
There's no way to do real magic, in the environment Monroe created.
He was trying to cook up a new magical system, so he could sell it to people. Castaneda fans in particular.
That's a seriously dirty link to intent, it drives the internal dialogue, and there's no way the assemblage point can move.
He just fell asleep, and made up stuff so he could steal from people. It's a very common technique used to fool followers by nearly all fake magical systems and religions.
Learn to move your assemblage point, or you'll be confused about what real magic is, for the rest of your life!
I suppose there might be some other form of magic out there somewhere, which doesn't involve moving the assemblage point.
But so far, no one can point to it.
Oddly, they don't even try once asked. They insist it's out there, but when you want them to show it so everyone can see what they believe is real, they won't do it.
Because actually they just read about it, and it was useful for self-soothing their unhappiness.
Often they point to a list of 10 things, hoping you're too lazy to take it on. The 10 things they've become deluded over, none of which they actually know much about.
And all of which have nothing real going on other than misrepresenting little dreams caused by boredom, practicing their technique.
You DON'T get bored, practicing sorcery once it starts working.
It's like the difference between going into a 7/11 to get a candy bar, or going into that famous candy store in Laguna beach.
Well, with the picture there’s no doubt. Double Bubble next to the Clorox at Monroe's? The variety of Taffy flavors in the Olmec place is truly amazing!
They have fried egg candy that looks just like a sunny side up egg. I took some young female friends there around 15 years ago, and then drinking in Laguna beach, and on the way home they were tossing candy eggs onto the windows of other cars.
Cholita would like doing that, if she wasn't so self-conscious.
She's been making loud noises all evening, which is a good thing. She was sneaking around for days before that, tiptoeing so I didn't realize she was around
And when I'm viewing the second attention strongly, if she happens to slam a door, I can see through the wall in her direction of an instant.
So it's better for me if she isn't in her sneaky mood.
I used to remote view her that way, until I mentioned it to her and she blocked it.
Westerly witches can do that. Block magic.
Never tell a witch if they show up in their double. Just keep it a secret between you, and their double.
Alright, noted about the witches’ double.
As for the witches of the East, that would be Zuleica, Josefina, and Cholita, right? Does “Margarita” (Chola?) also count there?
I agree with Techno from four years ago that I wouldn’t mind wearing second-hand clothes, which could even encourage us to create and refine “intentional cleansing rituals.” But it’s true: any witch worthy of the name would only accept used clothing if it came from a witch of greater seniority and rank in the lineage. https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/comments/oy4y4p/comment/h7t8hzq/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
About the fried-egg gummies—those were what your friends threw at the cars, right? Or were they hard candy?
There are puritans who close their eyes if a witch in a bikini walks by, but I must confess I even downloaded the photo of the woman-nahual you found, to keep a copy in case Reddit dies or something...
On this SubReddit I’ve read many times the phrase: “Cholita hid again.” And I won’t say “Oh, I understand,” because I don’t, but I’ll say I’ve experienced the strangeness of witches more than I’m willing to admit or confess.
A few years ago, I arranged to meet a Mexican witch and then didn’t show up.
She came furiously looking for me where I was, but first sent a huge dog to intimidate me. Then she started yelling things at me that made no apparent sense, but I noticed that “something” (now I know it was her ally) was pecking at my stomach and lower down...
We were side by side next to an old wooden table, and in the center there were some totopos (tortillas toasted on the comal). As soon as I saw them I lunged for them and she tried to stop me, but I grabbed them and began to eat them without hiding my joy.
She went completely mad. Side by side at the huge table, we began to circle; she wanted to catch me and I suppose kill me, but I had the totopos, so she simply cursed me.
“All right, as you wish,” I said. Then an old sorcerer friend burst in and she left.
The next day I had to leave, so she came to apologize and say goodbye, and she gave me a basket with venison meat and other foods. When it was time to depart, the car mysteriously broke down, so I had to stay longer in the area until I’d eaten the basket’s contents, which I suppose were the “antidote” to her curse.
“I’ll return with the rain,” I told her, but I couldn’t return the next rainy season. When I finally came back with the rain, near the village the car broke down again and I almost crashed into some rocks. I brought her some gifts, and I think we made peace—at least I hope so...
The old sorcerer told me very seriously: “Don’t you get it, are you pendejo? Never ever promise them anything unless you’re going to keep it.”
>Does “Margarita” (Chola?) also count there?
We don't know much about her other than that she was Carlos' "oldest friend".
Cholita lived with her once they imported her from that peyote field.
Where she got "lost" on her first try, and had to be pulled back from a white tunnel she wandered into.
Could you please share the woman-nagual picture with me?
Ah, what a Mezcalito so Cachondito!
I feel bad about re-uploading the photo, especially when you already have the medicine to find it: https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/comments/1mz6h6x/comment/nb7gy29/?context=3&utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Reading the Complete Post Index, I came across that photo once, twice, then three times. The third time I said: “It was destiny,” and I downloaded it. So, I wouldn’t want you to miss out on all those readings.
In the meantime, here’s something about nosebleeds, tinnitus, and the behavior of male and female chimpanzees: https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/comments/16xud85/whats_the_matter_with_nose_bleeds/
I am not following you. How is this nose bleeding connected? Anyway, I read the OP’s post, but I guess that isn’t enough. Are referring to dan’s comment or what?
The woman with grey hair in the back row, all the way on the left, in this pic.
And she's right of center in the back row in this pic.
And I made a post comparing the difference between her two eyes, purely out of curiosity.
Thank a lot mate. If only other members would be so normal/easygoing/down to earth. I remember don saying that the secret is in the left eye, that is, there is always something about the left eye that distinguishes a sorcerer from normal people.
If you're short of time, just go with the Magical Passes. I've been going over that one again lately, and it's like "the practical" with a cheat sheet. They're all about doing the tensegrity in a dark room here, so learning a few of those passes can start you on the road to discovery.
If you have more time, you should read the first four books. It's a great insight into humanity. Plus, there are a lot of techniques described. For instance, Castaneda ends up crossing his eyes in some of the teachings and this has happened to me while doing tensegrity, so the reference point can be helpful.
Castaneda's a great writer, you'll get hooked, I went on to read The Art of Dreaming, The Power of Silence and The Active Side of Infinity. If you like audiobooks, Luis Moreno does a fantastic job at narration, and the recordings are on YouTube.
Keep on flying!
I've read the books in chronological order 4 times and that's my recommendation. Although CC doesn't follow a strict chronological order, reading the books in that order makes actually sense. And I wouldn't skip the first book under any circumstances.
The only reason I suggest skipping it for a completely new reader (and circling back to it later) is that I, personally, am not at all certain that I would have been hooked by that first book if it had been the one that I read before any of the others.
It's decidedly more academic in tone, and that could discourage some from continuing.
After handling this beautiful knowledge for almost 10 years every day, this is a question I’ve asked myself a lot: How would I have like to read these books from the beginning? This is my preferred order:
These are the books I read regularly, and the rest of the collection, I read based on the necessity of the moment. In the past, I found the rest to add too much or too little, but there’s more than likely a future where I find some more meaning in those other books.
You could also consider reading one of the witches' books first. Florinda Donner- Grau and Taisha Abelar.
Read them in order. It’s the only way to read them, IMO. If you’re female you can read the witches books first and then read CC’s books in order.
That’s my 2 cents
Great idea! Encouraging unaware people to get involved with magic and to go on a wild goose chase for power. Thanks so much for your great advice.
I found A seperate reality first. Then did ixtlan and relized there was a first book and went back and read all 3 in order. That was a good base to understand the rest. The 4th was wild for all the side characters introduced for his party. I think fire within, eagles gift and the others were pivotal as the first 3. But ground yourself in the first 3 before he jumps and the rest from the second attention will be more helpful. The power plant stuff is interesting but mostly meant to knock his perception loose.
Whichever order you choose another read through will show new things missed from the previous time
Start with Journey to Ixtlan then Tales of Power. . Check in after that. I was fortunate to be 1 of a 100 people to attend the 1st tensegrity event at the Rim Institute in Payson AZ with Florinda, Tasha Carol and the Chacmools. I went to others, met Carlos at one and knew some of the inner circle who became very disillusioned and felt betrayed in the ending. Their are great truths in the stories but the big narrative is a bit suspect. Carlos nephew CJ trained in Kenpo Karate in Arizona and the Fire Series reminded me if Kenpo techniques exercises re-imagined. Check out the story Luck disguised as Ordinary Life by Nina Wise ....true story there
These are the notes we have, that survived, from that first workshop:
https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/wiki/workshop_notes/1993_07_rim_institute (I just created that page, by copy and pasting over from a URL on a site that Reddit doesn't like and thus blocks, for dubious reasons)
Where it's mentioned to have taken place in Paradise Valley, AZ. Some Google info:
Payson is a town located in northern Gila County, in the mountains of central Arizona. It is known for its cooler temperatures and is often referred to as "The Heart of Arizona." Population 17,000.
Paradise Valley is an affluent town located in Maricopa County, within the Phoenix metropolitan area. Population 12,700.
The two locations are about 65-75 miles apart by car, with Payson being a drive of over an hour and a half from Paradise Valley.
There was one more workshop held in Hawaii, and a seminar, then they only gave lecture appearances between the end of 1993 and February 1995, when the next full workshop took place in Santa Monica, CA.
I assume, amongst other things, they were working out how best to present the magical passes. How much of what they had each learned practicing martial arts should be incorporated in between the individual sorcery movements, so they flowed between each other.
As opposed to being singular, and very individualistic and ritualistic, movements.
There's no mention of a Fire Series at the Rim Institute, which could just mean the note takers missed it; but there is a Fire Form that was first presented in the year 2000, and Cleargreen was known for releasing their own (modified) version of some older passes that were only presented and never methodically taught to attendees...or were ones only shown to the inner circle.
https://reddit.com/r/castaneda/w/tensegrity/animal_forms/fire_form
“Luck Disguised As Ordinary Life” by Nina Wise (Sun Magazine):
https://web.archive.org/web/20030718075800/http://nagual.com/ixtlan/interviews/sun1.html
Lay out all of the books in front of you and look at the cover art and if one of them in particular catches your interest, start there, the chronology doesn't matter because eternity isn't linear
Also, like this place, there are a lot of "frayed ends" of the line where you can pick up a thing or two, try to find them